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  2. Travex - Last Tuesday at 5:03 PM
  3. Hurry home friend, this trash tier guild needs 1 other person besides like...myself mayb hypo who actually want to get cutting edge. I'm one stupid comment from gquitting.
  4. Bubbles - Last Tuesday at 5:04 PM
  5. sorry man but your approach to improving something is wrong
  6. Travex - Last Tuesday at 5:04 PM
  7. elaborate
  8. Bubbles - Last Tuesday at 5:04 PM
  9. you cannot “officer me or i quit”
  10. everyone thats done this leading thing will tell you
  11. your efforts will get you there alone
  12. you dont need to force that
  13. Travex - Last Tuesday at 5:05 PM
  14. ofc I can, if my preferred option at this point bc nobody is doing shit is to quit - then I can certainly present this alternative.
  15. Bubbles - Last Tuesday at 5:05 PM
  16. thats not how it works
  17. Travex - Last Tuesday at 5:05 PM
  18. If they dont like it that's fine, but nobody is doing anything whatsoever to actualyl progress, its brute force as fk
  19. Bubbles - Last Tuesday at 5:06 PM
  20. youll lose no matter what on your end
  21. youll never be an officer of a good guild with your approach
  22. lead by example and your example
  23. leaves a sour taste
  24. Travex - Last Tuesday at 5:08 PM
  25. I've been an officer in literally all but one of the guilds ive been in, but thx?
  26. Bubbles - Last Tuesday at 5:08 PM
  27. and now you are not
  28. you want to force your way up and hold something as leverage then good luck to you with.a guild that tolerates that and survives
  29. if you want change all you do is suggest things
  30. Travex - Last Tuesday at 5:13 PM
  31. You misunderstand, there is ho holding leverage, with the way this shit show is proceeding leaving is a desirable course of action. I am,however, not the kind of person who likes to guild hop and would prefer to fix this slop raid rather than finding a new one. However I am new and don't have the kind of influence I think I need to properly impliment what this guild needs to actually kill things - so I proposed a solution, take it or leave it. A few people on horde asked me to stay so I capitulated and decided to start working on fixing this guild, but I can't do it alone for the aforementioned reasons. Now I can sit here and argue with you for some unknown reason about what you think I'm trying to do or you can acknowledge the problems and the efforts and work with me? You're taking all of this either too personally or reading this as if there is hostility in my words where there is none.
  32. Bubbles - Last Tuesday at 5:16 PM
  33. it doesnt matter what youre saying if you at any point “officer me or i gquit” i am done with you. i was gm of a guild remember and while did some questionable things, me taking 0 shits from anyone and dropping people who uses threats is not one of them. all you had to do is literally suggest actual issues to fix. some of your issues arent actually issues tbh.
  34. if you had good intentions
  35. im sorry
  36. you approached this incorrectly
  37. some of your issues i can fix just by being there. some are already being worked on
  38. some are legit not necessary
  39. none of which required you to hold your position in the guild as leverage
  40. Travex - Last Tuesday at 5:20 PM
  41. I've been watching in the last month and a half as the walls and firmament burn slowly around me. I've been trying to propose changes and improve the group over that course of time as you have been suggesting but literally 0 zero squat nothing has changed, so all I did was stop whispering and grabbed the bull horn.
  42. Bubbles - Last Tuesday at 5:23 PM
  43. like i hear about issues myself but who are you talking to for changes?? none of the things you made a post about made it to me. im doing what i can here in vietnam. its 6am and here i am. ive been recruiting sitting over here. ive gone over some logs for people already.
  44. like in terms of boss kills
  45. its literally just recruit better players
  46. theres nothing to those fights
  47. i shouldnt have to wake up to pages of dicussion over kingaroth
  48. Travex - Last Tuesday at 5:24 PM
  49. Exactly?
  50. Bubbles - Last Tuesday at 5:25 PM
  51. but thats it
  52. and ive been looking for better players
  53. Travex - Last Tuesday at 5:25 PM
  54. So have I, I've been posting in all the discords since you left /shrug
  55. Bubbles - Last Tuesday at 5:26 PM
  56. i dont always have time to see it or hear it if its said on discord
  57. if it gets lost in other messages
  58. Travex - Last Tuesday at 5:26 PM
  59. ok lets back up a second
  60. lets put all the shit u have taken issue with aside for a minute
  61. we're on the same page, with the same agenda and goals
  62. Bubbles - Last Tuesday at 5:27 PM
  63. lets stop there
  64. Travex - Last Tuesday at 5:27 PM
  65. Are you and the "officers" willing to work with me as a peer toward those goals or am I just a frustrated voice whose opinions will be buried under those the aforementioned deem more valuable?
  66. Bubbles - Last Tuesday at 5:27 PM
  67. my goal is top 100
  68. i simply dont think most of what you want is needed to get top 100
  69. everything youve proposed if that was all implemented thats a top 30 guild
  70. yes it would be better
  71. thats not wrong
  72. but is it needed or should even be considered with awareness of these other issues? no
  73. Travex - Last Tuesday at 5:30 PM
  74. And my question
  75. remains
  76. Bubbles - Last Tuesday at 5:34 PM
  77. your opinions will be picked apart and whatever seems plausible and relevant will be addressed but
  78. you need to understand that if theres a some money in a pile of shit how much would there have to be for me to bother trying
  79. Travex - Last Tuesday at 5:36 PM
  80. I don't know what you mean with that
  81. Bubbles - Last Tuesday at 5:36 PM
  82. you clouded fair points with useless ones
  83. not useless
  84. Travex - Last Tuesday at 5:36 PM
  85. Subjective
  86. Bubbles - Last Tuesday at 5:36 PM
  87. just not relevant at the moment
  88. Travex - Last Tuesday at 5:37 PM
  89. Sure, there's an heirarchy of which solutions to each individual problem should be addressed given resources and time, if that's what you mean - but identifying all at once and then at that point working forward with that heirarchy is certainly more efficient.
  90. Bubbles - Last Tuesday at 5:38 PM
  91. some are not needed at all truthfully as well
  92. Travex - Last Tuesday at 5:38 PM
  93. Such as
  94. Bubbles - Last Tuesday at 5:38 PM
  95. a website
  96. no one cares about it and if they do why????
  97. yes you can have a forums
  98. but like
  99. that means you have to somehow
  100. get an entire guild to check that
  101. just for a forums
  102. Travex - Last Tuesday at 5:41 PM
  103. because the single biggest issue this guild has is preparedness, there is basically nothing at all in that raid discussion discord channel before today, as evidence. Where are the kill vids, where are the blueprints, the discussion of how our guild wants to approach the fight differently than the kills linked previously bc our raid comp, right now we literally go in, Noor says ok here are ehte things that are different from heroic - which already implies people don't know, even having to review them means youre operating under the assumption of poor preparedness from your raid, and then says "let's give this a twirl" and I swear to god I die a little inside every time he says it
  104. Bubbles - Last Tuesday at 5:43 PM
  105. all you had to do was whisper one of the officers asking for a meeting
  106. Travex - Last Tuesday at 5:43 PM
  107. dude
  108. Bubbles - Last Tuesday at 5:43 PM
  109. and to bring those up
  110. and if you dont get that
  111. Travex - Last Tuesday at 5:43 PM
  112. ive been trying to get this stuff through for like 2 months
  113. all of this
  114. nobody listens
  115. thats exactly why were here today
  116. bc I feel like no1 gives a shit
  117. no1 listens
  118. its frustating as fuck
  119. Bubbles - Last Tuesday at 5:44 PM
  120. so you are telling me
  121. you messaged for a meeting with the officers
  122. got one and
  123. nothing happened?
  124. Travex - Last Tuesday at 5:46 PM
  125. I'm saying I've messaged and / or spoken over discord on several occasions with bill, zach, revenge about most of the things we're talking about, yes. As far as a "meeting" please that's laughable. There arent even meetings after raid or anything resembling them to discuss the raids, 95% of the guild logs the other 5% plays PubG
  126. Bubbles - Last Tuesday at 5:47 PM
  127. then thats on you.
  128. if you didnt ask for one
  129. Travex - Last Tuesday at 5:47 PM
  130. wat
  131. ur memeing me
  132. Bubbles - Last Tuesday at 5:47 PM
  133. ill tell you the best people
  134. were the ones that messaged me to chat in officer channel
  135. to address things
  136. thats all it takes
  137. Travex - Last Tuesday at 5:48 PM
  138. the people youre talking about dont even meet themselves and you think that it would have been a smart idea to  me in turn to ask for a meeting with all of said people
  139. please.
  140. Bubbles - Last Tuesday at 5:48 PM
  141. give them a reason to.
  142. that is your role as a raider
  143. to give reasons for officers to meet
  144. Travex - Last Tuesday at 5:49 PM
  145. I think your logic is severly flawed given the realities of this guild, but regardless I'm sure they've met now so..
  146. at least there's that.
  147. Bubbles - Last Tuesday at 5:51 PM
  148. theres been no meeting
  149. its discord
  150. messages are saved
  151. you dont need to have everyone in the same room at the same time to talk about issues
  152. Travex - Last Tuesday at 5:53 PM
  153. exactly. my. point.
  154. Bubbles - Last Tuesday at 5:57 PM
  155. so what is your point
  156. by telling officers hey id like for you all to be here at the same time
  157. you are letting the officers know its important
  158. its not hard to do and that was your mistake if you did not do that
  159. Travex - Last Tuesday at 5:59 PM
  160. You said I needed a meeting to proprely communicate. I said I messaged several people across a decent amount of time about all the things discussed. Then I said that's an unrealistic expectation given the 0% of meetings those people currently engage in. Then you said jk there's no need for a meeting to get your points accross.
  161. Bubbles - Last Tuesday at 5:59 PM
  162. its not unrealisistic
  163. Bubbles - Last Tuesday at 6:00 PM
  164. legit you approached this as “if i want change ill do it myself”
  165. Travex - Last Tuesday at 6:01 PM
  166. No, that's how you're seeing it bc you are not the aggregate of the all the aforementioned people I contacted regarding my issues.
  167. Bubbles - Last Tuesday at 6:01 PM
  168. so make that meeting happen to address core issues and state that you are unhappy
  169. then idk what to tell you
  170. Travex - Last Tuesday at 6:01 PM
  171. ok we're going in circles - if you want me to ping all of you and ask for a meeting moving forward - if thats what you think is best that's what ill do, but at this current juncture its almost moot
  172. Bubbles - Last Tuesday at 6:01 PM
  173. if you contacted all these people for change
  174. and nothing change
  175. d
  176. leave
  177. but youll get nothing by brute forcing to officer
  178. Travex - Last Tuesday at 6:02 PM
  179. but this guild is all about brute force
  180. lels
  181. Bubbles - Last Tuesday at 6:03 PM
  182. if thats how you feel about it fine
  183. i just think you approached it wrong given what i know
  184. at no point did you message me stating some issues youd like to see fixed that i didnt address
  185. if you think 6 players need to be replaced
  186. thats fine
  187. ive been recruiting
  188. if you think we need a website ive told you i dont personally think thats needed
  189. Travex - Last Tuesday at 6:05 PM
  190. you havent been here dawg, I did as much recruitment posting as I thought was reasonable and spoke to the people who were here
  191. about the rest
  192. I'm not blaming u, I understand ur situation but don't expect me to rely on someone who hasnt been here for like 4 weeks in another country, thats equally silly
  193. Bubbles - Last Tuesday at 6:06 PM
  194. at no point
  195. did you talk to me about that
  196. see
  197. YOU fucked up
  198. i bump my thread multiple times a day here
  199. ive added at least 20 players here
  200. if i need help i contact people for it
  201. or they contact me
  202. Travex - Last Tuesday at 6:08 PM
  203. remind me how I fucked up?
  204. Bubbles - Last Tuesday at 6:09 PM
  205. your approach.
  206. Travex - Last Tuesday at 6:10 PM
  207. My approach of messaging several officers about all my concerns multiple times instead of pinging everyone for a meeting which you yourself claim is not necessary?
  208. Bubbles - Last Tuesday at 6:10 PM
  209. see heres the thing
  210. hypo messaged me too about concerns
  211. Travex - Last Tuesday at 6:11 PM
  212. Doesn't matter, we're going in circles and clearly you're getting heated for no reason. We're on the same team, I'm clearly willing to push for change that we need, if you are too and you're willing to work with me we can put all of this aside and make it happen.
  213. Bubbles - Last Tuesday at 6:11 PM
  214. and i talked about each one
  215. and what to do to fix it
  216. Travex - Last Tuesday at 6:11 PM
  217. All you're saying is that you're more responsive than the people I messaged
  218. Bubbles - Last Tuesday at 6:12 PM
  219. see i dont know what they got but i do not believe they ignore legit concerns
  220. you as a raider
  221. do no have officer chat so whatever you say
  222. not*
  223. is lost to everyone else
  224. Travex - Last Tuesday at 6:12 PM
  225. I wouldn't believe it either if I didnt live it, which again - is why I grabbed the metaphorical bullhorn and why were having this convo at all
  226. Bubbles - Last Tuesday at 6:13 PM
  227. we as officers have o chat so that stuff gets seen by all of us
  228. Travex - Last Tuesday at 6:13 PM
  229. Just another reason I asked for officer
  230. Bubbles - Last Tuesday at 6:13 PM
  231. you dont so you need to schedule a meeting
  232. no
  233. you ask for a meeting so every officer sees or hears everything
  234. Travex - Last Tuesday at 6:14 PM
  235. We're doing heroic atm, and this conversation is becoming painfully cyclical - can you put aside your hangups from the last two days aside and work with me to help patch the numerous holes the group has or am I going to keep being ignored as I feel like I have been the last month and a half yes or no
  236. Bubbles - Last Tuesday at 6:15 PM
  237. youve lost footing
  238. Travex - Last Tuesday at 6:16 PM
  239. and yet more has happened since sunday than it has since I got here
  240. Say what you will but a fire was lit under their asses
  241. on sunday
  242. Bubbles - Last Tuesday at 6:16 PM
  243. no not at all
  244. Travex - Last Tuesday at 6:16 PM
  245. nigga you werent even ehre
  246. Bubbles - Last Tuesday at 6:16 PM
  247. this is all not needed
  248. 10 discord pages of kingaroth
  249. i dont need to dissect it that much
  250. do more add dmg stop getting hit by a ball
  251. Travex - Last Tuesday at 6:23 PM
  252. Saying that hasnt seemed to work
  253. If it were that easy we should just yell "KILL THE BOSS" every attempt
  254. OH LORD and we still have people who dont use push to talk. Should I have called an officer meeting for that too?
  255. Bubbles - Last Tuesday at 6:36 PM
  256. if its an issue
  257. Travex - Last Tuesday at 6:37 PM
  258. You enjoy raiding in a call center/dog pound?
  259. Bubbles - Last Tuesday at 6:37 PM
  260. then tell them turn on ptt
  261. Travex - Last Tuesday at 6:39 PM
  262. cmon man
  263. ive been saying it literally every single raid
  264. every. single. raid.
  265. this is what im talkni about
  266. no1 listens
  267. Bubbles - Last Tuesday at 6:41 PM
  268. cuz they have reasons to switch it every time then
  269. Travex - Last Tuesday at 6:41 PM
  270. Why are you so vehemently defending the indefensible?
  271. Bubbles - Last Tuesday at 6:42 PM
  272. what are you talking about
  273. if it gets swapped from ptt to voice activated
  274. they changed it for a reason
  275. i know i had to sometimes
  276. my ptt doesnt work with some other games
  277. so i gotta turn on voice activity
  278. Travex - Last Tuesday at 6:44 PM
  279. Ok, but you arent one of the people who have 4 dogs who bark in their background or whose phone I have to hear 14 times per pull are you
  280. No1 would be able to tell the difference when youre using ptt or not bc you dont present the same issues.If you did I'd have the same complaints.
  281. Bubbles - Last Tuesday at 6:46 PM
  282. tell that to the guy to not swap it
  283. and keep it pttt
  284. if that doesnt change
  285. tell me
  286. thats all u gotta do and say its been a recurring problem
  287. Travex - Last Tuesday at 6:47 PM
  288. ok so
  289. saying something about it
  290. a total of probably 25 times realistically
  291. is not good enoguh
  292. is what ur saying
  293. please stop trolling me
  294. It's like at this point you just don't want to cede anything, stubbornly
  295. and idk why
  296. Bubbles - Last Tuesday at 6:55 PM
  297. IF THAT DOEDNT CHANGE
  298. TELL ME
  299. THATS ALL U HAVE TO DO
  300. at no point was i told anything tht i did not address
  301. Travex - Last Tuesday at 6:59 PM
  302. You've been in vietnam for like a month, why in the world would I bother you with it when there are like 4 officers here
  303. Saying it's my fault for not messaging you specifically isn't an arguement
  304. Bubbles - Last Tuesday at 7:00 PM
  305. none of them did anything??
  306. Travex - Last Tuesday at 7:00 PM
  307. THATS WHAT IVE BEEN SAYING THE ENTIRE TIME
  308. Bubbles - Last Tuesday at 7:00 PM
  309. i do not believe that they did nothing about
  310. issues
  311. Travex - Last Tuesday at 7:00 PM
  312. NOBODY LISTENS OR DOES ANYTHIGN
  313. and now you know why we are where we are with all this
  314. finally, hopefully
  315. A perfect example: They believed we'd kill kingaroth wednesday. We still havent killed it. _BUT__ if that's how they felt where are the resources for Varimathras?
  316. Bubbles - Last Tuesday at 7:08 PM
  317. is it not simply expected to just watch a fatboss video
  318. on your own
  319. or whatever your preferred boss guide
  320. there can be variance in strat sure
  321. but that depends on your comp
  322. and you dont always know what you have going in
  323. Travex - Last Tuesday at 7:10 PM
  324. The fact that you aren't specifying one guide already means there is flexibility in the strat you could be using, which is part of what should be presented to your raiders - things they can watch or read to best understand the mechanics and how the raid will interact with them in addition to how this raid will specifically modify whatever is generally accepted bc of our raid comp or habits. And don't ever assume, assuming is a stupid thing to do, you know damn well there is a high % of the raid that doesn't do literally any research and just slams their face against the fight until they learn it well enough to pass by with a killl
  325. Bubbles - Last Tuesday at 7:11 PM
  326. its not assume its expected
  327. if they dont watch the video
  328. thats a different issue than having it posted
  329. literally watch fatboss
  330. thats it
  331. if theres a different preferred video
  332. thatll be linked
  333. otherwise theres only like one strat a fight
  334. and you tweak upon pulls with your raid comp
  335. i just dont understand whats failing or why these issues exist
  336. as a raider you watch that one video and thats all you have to do
  337. these bosses arent hard at all
  338. and all these proposed change are so out of proportion given that its literally play the gsme better honestly
  339. press your dos buttons to kill add faster
  340. look at the ball and dont get hit
  341. not to say that we dont need it
  342. but for these bosses? literally just play better
  343. Travex - Last Tuesday at 7:33 PM
  344. I agree wholeharded with  everything you just said.
  345. The definition of insanity is doing the same thing over and over again expecting a different result.
  346. last couple bosses we've had a chronic issue of people clearly being un-informed or under-informed about the boss strat and furthermore how we will approach it. If we change nothing that issue will persist on every boss from here to Argus, hence why I would suggest we do what every Top 100 guild does and have a forum to post vids/blueprints/guides and allow discussion there for people to interact with before we pull each boss. Make no change and expect us to not have that issue a 3rd time and you're by definition insane.
  347. But this is just one of the complaints, right, the principle is applicable throughout
  348. January 11, 2018
  349. Travex - Yesterday at 8:11 PM
  350. when do u get home? lobsta and I could use a dps for carries
  351. Bubbles - Yesterday at 8:13 PM
  352. i aint got time for that when im@home
  353. got so much other shit to do
  354. Travex - Yesterday at 8:13 PM
  355. Its dungeon week, you'll need at least 4 mythic +'s for the box, kill 2 birds with one stone XD
  356. Bubbles - Yesterday at 8:13 PM
  357. eh
  358. well see what i want to do
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