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TVTropes: Internet Backdraft examples II - October 10, 2012

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  1. [Video Games]
  2.  
  3.  VideoGames are a relatively new form of media, at least when compared to how long radio, television, and feature films have been around. Like them, whenever a controversial event or any argument over polarizing concepts occurs in the realm of video games, expect an InternetBackdraft to occur.
  4. ----
  5. [[foldercontrol]]
  6.  
  7. [[folder:Consoles/Platforms and Game Media]]
  8. * The ConsoleWars; usually, which of the current generation is better, but occasionally spilling into SuperNintendo vs. SegaGenesis or {{Dreamcast}} vs. anything else.
  9. ** And, more recently, [[PCvsConsole [=PCs=] vs consoles]].
  10. ** Paint yourself in asbestos, go to any gaming forum and quote any article written in the last ''twenty years'' that says 'PC Gaming is Dead/Dying'. Bonus points if you can link one such article from the late 80s and nobody notices.
  11. ** An example of flame wars being born over this is [[http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7FN3HXTqIDU Chad Warden's infamous sarcastic rant]] asserting that the "PS Triple" is better than the Wii and Xbox 360. Many people took it seriously and thus began a Youtube flamewar, with many videos of Chad Warden's rant remixed into all sorts of mocking messages.
  12. * One notable flamewar centers on Sony's removal of the Other OS function in the PS3, meaning you can't use Linux on your PS3 anymore.
  13. * {{PSP}} vs. [=PSPgo=]. And by extension, physical game media versus digital download.
  14. * Implying that you prefer the ''SegaSaturn'' over the ''{{Playstation}}'' or ''NintendoSixtyFour'' can be a death sentence. Even stating that the Saturn was good, even in Japan, can cause problems. Don't even try to mention the the "{{Dreamcast}} 2" myths, or if you want a Dreamcast.
  15. * Whether or not {{Microsoft}} should make a handheld is quite the issue within the gaming community.
  16. * After the [[HypeBacklash commercial failure]] of the Nintendo3DS, Nintendo dropped the price of the system to a paltry $170 in the US, literally ''5 months'' after its release. People who bought it prior to the price drop, despite Nintendo trying to compensate with a collection of 20 games (most of them classics like ''SuperMarioBros'' and ''YoshisIsland''), were not pleased.
  17. * Mention mobile OS platforms such as Android, [=iOS=], and Windows Phone 7 are gaming platforms. Or that you "game" on a cell phone in general. Cue those who will eat you out and saying how ''AngryBirds'', or anything else that can be found on a phone, isn't a real game, or just a shoddy rip-off, or some other discrediting description.
  18. * {{DLC}} as a whole will lead to two BrokenBase arguing with each other, with one half despising DLC, and the other half praising them. The fact is that DLC can have a lot of different meanings, DLC can be of ''very'' different types, and the absence of clear legislation about it doesn't really help, leaving the editors to do as they please when they propose DLC:
  19. ** On the side of those who hate DLC, we have understable complaints, since some DLC are content removed from the game in order to sell it under the disguise of DLC (such as some missions of ''VideoGame/AssassinsCreedII''), content already on the disk but that you need to unlock with a DLC in order to use it (such as the costumes of ''VideoGame/StreetFighterIV''), content which could be seen as vital (or at least very useful) but that you need to buy as DLC in order to use it (such as the chest in which you can store your equipment in DragonAgeOrigins), or even some content which we can reasonably think should have been available in the game right from the start instead of being sold separately as DLC (such as the costumes and arena fights of VideoGame/{{VideoGame/FinalFantasyXIII-2}}, DLC available since the release of the game). Some DLC are not new content, but just a way to [[BribingYourWayToVictory bribe your way to victory]] (such as some DLC in VideoGame/TalesOfVesperia, which allow the player to gain levels, money, artes, items... It's not so much "downloadable content" here, and more like "paying cheat codes"). And let's not start about the activation codes of BatmanArkhamCity, preventing you from accessing a part of the game if you buy a second hand copy of the game instead of a new one, which will make you unable to enjoy it... Unless you buy the DLC which allows access to these parts of the game. Overall, this side sees DLC as a cash machine for the editors, and fear that they are considered as cash cows.
  20. ** On the other hand, the other side argues that DLC can provide new content and fun to a game long after its release, allowing us to prolong the experience. Also, some DLC are whole new levels or adventures, depending on the game, which can lead some DLC as being seen as true extensions. Needless to say, it depends heavily on the quality of the DLC.
  21. *** When one side will complain about the presence of DLC, the other side will often point to the other that they are not forced to buy DLC, which will lead this side to argue about the abuses of game companies when it comes to DLC, which will lead the other side to argue that some DLC are worth it, which can lead some people to say that the content should have been in the game originally, etc... Rinse and repeat ''ad nauseum''.
  22. * Anything that has to do with console exclusivity. Probably the worst offender is when a DLC is released for PS3 instead of Xbox 360, or vice versa.
  23. ** And for that matter, the only super-platforms of video games that exists are [=PCs=], consoles, and handhelds. Do NOT acknoledge the existence of arcade games made after ''VideoGame/StreetFighterII''.
  24. * One of the biggest ways to kick up a fuss is to ask whether a hot console exclusive or console-exclusive bonus content will be ported to another system. Most fanboys of the system that exclusive belongs to will immediately lambast you with flames. The more rational amongst them will give you plenty of reasons why such a port [[LikeYouWouldReallyDoIt will never happen]], [[NotSoStoic usually peppered with flames]]. You'll also probably be told that you're cheap and that you need to buy the original system, and/or will be told to go have your mommy buy it for you. This typically happens when PS3 or 360 owners ask about things being ported to the other system, though it sometimes happens with situations like PSP games potentially being ported to the PS2. (The Wii and DS are often left out of this loop, due to fundamental hardware differences. Wii titles are ''always'' assumed to be fundamentally different from their PS3/360 counterparts anyways, due to the Wii's inferior processing power and {{waggle}}-based controls.)
  25. ** This happened in a BIG way when rumors of a [=MGS4=] port to the Xbox 360 surfaced, complete with images of a [=MGS4=] 360 skin. Whether they were real or not doesn't matter, it started a giant flame war. Said [=MGS4=] port turned into the ''Metal Gear Solid: Rising''.
  26. *** And this is coming up again with ''VideoGame/StreetFighterXTekken'', since it was revealed that the 360 would get no exclusives whatsoever and the PS3 will be getting '''five''' exclusive characters...two of them being PacMan and VideoGame/MegaMan (Okay...Bad Box Art Mega Man...but people are mad all the same)
  27. ** Of course, if said port actually ''does'' happen down the road, expect an enormous backlash, with fans of the original system complaining about being "betrayed" by the company that decided to port over the game, and fans of the system the game is being newly ported to coming over with victorious "I told you so" remarks.
  28. * Uploaded a video of yourself playing a game? Expect people in the comments section to blast you over how you play, including the StophavingFunGuys. From there, you can also watch people responding to those comments and it snowballs from there.
  29. * If you're a game publisher, just don't decide to region-lock a PS3 game. Fans of the console take pride in the fact that all games published so far are region free, and will defend that pride like angry junkyard dobermans. EA, Midway and Sega learnt that the hard way with their announcement of region-locking for Army of Two, John Woo's Stranglehold and Bayonetta respectively, and were quick to eat their words when confronted with threats of boycott from angry PS3 owners. Atlus, determined to try anyway with Persona4Arena, is now apparently in for it as many European gamers are enacting boycotts and cancelling their pre-orders of the game left and right.
  30.  
  31. [[/folder]]
  32. [[folder:Companies and Individuals]]
  33. * {{Capcom}} has been getting [[FlameBait massive]], [[UnstoppableRage massive]] [[{{Hatedom}} amounts]] of flak for [[{{Vaporware}} cancelling]] the third ''VideoGame/MegaManLegends'' game, especially so shortly after cancelling ''Mega Man Universe''... and announcing ''[[CapcomSequelStagnation another]]'' [[UpdatedRerelease version]] of ''VideoGame/MarvelVsCapcom3''.
  34. ** And now that the new characters for ''Ultimate Marvel Vs. Capcom 3'' have been leaked, Mega Man himself is ''still'' nowhere to be seen. Mega Man fans are seething with enough rage to power a solar system.
  35. *** Even more fuel was added to the fire when it was revealed that Zero's {{DLC}} costume turned him into VideoGame/MegaManX (and that Frank West's was the Mega Man suit from the original ''DeadRising''), with many claiming that Capcom did it to deliberately {{Troll}} them.
  36. ** And then there's Street Fighter X Hello Kitty... Yes, HelloKitty. A franchise that is blatantly aimed at prepubescent girls. Needless to say, this left several people completely nonplussed...until Capcom revealed that the crossover really is for [[http://www.cinemablend.com/games/Capcom-Responds-Hello-Kitty-X-Street-Fighter-Game-33803.html merchandise (toys, dolls, figurines, etc.) in which Sanrio characters]][[http://www.1up.com/news/street-fighter-hello-kitty-merchandise are depicted in Street Fighter costumes.]] There are no plans for an actual game...yet.
  37. ** Mega Man fans are '''furious''' about his inclusion in ''VideoGame/StreetFighterXTekken''. Why? Because not only did they give him his OffModel appearance from the first game's NES cover, but deliberately made him a middle-aged, fat loser who just screams "JokeCharacter." Capcom's mishandling of the series is one thing, but deliberately rubbing salt on the wound by ''turning your company mascot into a complete joke'' may just drive them over the edge. It doesn't help that his bio is almost identical to [[VideoGame/MegaManLegends Trigger's]] bio, which only serves to remind people of the cancellation that started this whole mess. Keiji Inafune ''himself'', who was currently working at Capcom at the time before the games above were canceled, made the decision to use the "Bad Boxart Megaman" design when Mega Man was included in the character roster. [[DudeNotFunny Not that it has stopped fans from]] [[TooSoon screeching at Capcom about the design decision]] (it was supposed to be a joke, but it backfired immensely).
  38. ***
  39. ** And then, Capcom outright stated that they were trying to draw in VideoGame/CallOfDuty fans, even calling it "the dream," and they were deliberately making ''[[ResidentEvil6 RE6]]'' more [[ActionizedSequel action-based]] to do so. Cue fan backlash at Capcom "dumbing down" RE for the LowestCommonDenominator, and people retracting their excitement for the game. [[SarcasmMode Nice going, Capcom.]]
  40. ** Three words: On-Disc DLC. This already caused controversy elsewhere, but the ''VideoGame/StreetFighterXTekken'' DLC fiasco takes the cake. It was announced that a huge chunk of characters would be exclusive to the PlaystationVita for a time(Beyond characters from Sony franchises, of course). Of course, Xbox/PC fans felt cheated. But when the game came out, a few enterprising hackers found out that these characters were not only still in the game's code, but were fully playable, complete with their own story and endings. Fans, to say the least, were furious at the obvious cash grab.
  41. ** Capcom's path towards ruination just keep on going, when 4-player co-op was removed from the Xbox version of SFXT, [[TheyJustDidntCare despite the fact that it's still displayed in the manual AND promised to be there.]] Unlike the above debacle, Capcom has no plans to patch this, and pulling an explanation out of their ass that the PS3 was more conductive to this feature(despite the fact that [[VideoGame/MortalKombat9 another fighter]] had this feature on both consoles). It's one thing to remove a feature because of technical limitations, but to do so unannounced and seemingly out of laziness is maddening.
  42. ** Ace Attorney fans weren't too happy ''at all'' when Capcom gave the NoExportForYou treatment to Ace Attorney Investigations 2. The petition for it to be released is still up.
  43. ** ''Street Fighter'' and ''Mega Man'' both celebrate their 25th anniversary in 2012. The ''Street Fighter'' celebration was announced early in the year as a massive package including nearly every Street Fighter game, plus several feelies and [=DVDs=] for only $150. The ''Mega Man'' celebration was announced in August and consists of an overpriced soundtrack collection ($200 for music that's been long available for free), and an ''iPhone game.'' The sound you hear is Mega Man fans spontaneously combusting in rage.
  44. ** The 25th anniversary celebrations for Megaman, by the way, won't be announced until ''after'' the anniversary, which is too late to build up hype for it (to say the least).
  45. ** And because it's hardly surprising by this point, Capcom may have cancelled yet another upcoming Megaman game. A Korean MMO called ''Megaman Online'', which was in development for over ''a year and a half''. Leaving the aforementioned IOS as the only upcoming Megaman game...
  46. *** So, to recap, MegaMan's 25th anniversary is marked by the cancellation of literally every MegaMan game that had been announced, one of which the fans and the character's creator have been demanding for over a decade, and an iPhone game with bad graphics ([[http://www.gamesabyss.com/rockman-is-over-xover-hands-on-impressions/ and gameplay]]) in a genre that few, if any, of MegaMan's long-time fans are likely to be interested in.
  47. * {{Nintendo}}'s recent business decisions and the fact [[CashCowFranchise they keep milking their top franchises dry]] have come under criticism in recent years. The more hardline Nintendo fans, and even Nintendo itself, tend to be derided as [[NostalgiaFilter living in the past]], unable to accept the current trends that Sony and Microsoft are adopting in their game consoles.
  48. ** If you really want to see the savageness of fanboys, just go to any Nintendo-based forum and proudly state that you approve of Nintendo's direction with casuals/casual gaming and how it doesn't need HD graphics or super online. Expect to see phrases like "true gamer" and "sold out to the casuals" being thrown around.
  49. *** Gaming becoming popular wasn't supposed to be like this. They were supposed to get more of their games, and we were supposed to keep getting our games. Why can't it be like that?
  50. *** Not only that, but Nintendo's 2008 E3 event left its fanboys foaming at the mouth, wishing Nintendo to burn in hell after saying they had been lied to about Nintendo claiming to be revealing some games that weren't casual (aka core titles like Mario and Kid Icarus). Reggie's co-worker explaining about her broken wrist has already become [[MemeticMutation a popular fad on forums]].
  51. *** In a funny twist, with the announcement of the WiiU having HD graphics, a good chunk of fans are proudly touting this as a great feature. Bring up how they didn't care for HD graphics for the Wii and watch the fireworks.
  52. ** Want to see Nintendo fanboys explode in rage? Suggest the idea that Nintendo should adopt the achievement (Xbox360) or trophy (PS3) system because it adds more replay value. Replies will include "How did you play games before achievements?" and "Achievements don't give you anything."
  53. *** [[HilariousInHindsight Funnily enough,]] Nintendo seems to have adopted a similar system for the WiiU. Fans were surprisingly bemused.
  54. ** Bringing up the subject of limited online and friend codes to Nintendo Wii fans can be hazardous to your health. Mention that you think Wii games should have more comprehensive online modes/play and you'll either be labeled a StopHavingFunGuy who wants Wii games to be havens for cheaters and griefers, or worse, you'll be told that you only want to play online so much because you don't have any real friends. Of particular controversy are the debates over the limited online play in ''SuperSmashBrothers Brawl'' and the lack of online multiplayer in ''New SuperMarioBros Wii''.
  55. *** Of course, this can cut the other way, with particularly zealous proponents of online play labeling Wii players as "mindless fanboys" or "casualfags".
  56. ** Bring up voice acting and Nintendo in the same sentence and watch flame wars break out over whether or not Nintendo has to start using voice acting or are fine without them.
  57. * Mention any EA game from ''[[strike:{{Spore}}]]'' ''MassEffect'' onwards and [[CopyProtection SecuROM]] on the same sentence. You can expect carnages on the level done by that DRM, the morality of pirating, and all that wazoo.
  58. ** Or, heck, bring up EA in general, particularly if you bring up anything speaking in their defense, or otherwise question their internet ButtMonkey status.
  59. ** Newest offender: EA's "Online Pass" and used games.
  60. ** EA apparently is losing its spot as most hated company in the web to {{Activision}}, since EA is releasing popular titles such as ''Franchise/DeadSpace'', and Activision is becoming more proeficient at milking {{Cash Cow Franchise}}s and destroying developers.
  61. ** And then gained it back when it announced the Origin cloud based distribution system. Which sells EA exclusive games with little chance of a sale like {{Steam}}, as well as running poorly, lacking the features of Steam, and [[BreadEggsMilkSquick periodically scanning the user's hard drive]].
  62. * If you want a real flame war, try and mention [[XPlay G4TV]] and its status as a credible news source. Watch as people crawl out of the woodwork, either stating that they are the best news source ever, or a FoxNews-esque mouthpiece for "hardcore" players. But whatever you do, don't mention them in front of Nintendo fans.
  63. ** More importantly, if you value your soul, '''''never''''' state that their response to ''SkywardSword'' winning the 2011 Videogame Deathmatch was justified. Even fans of the games that got shot down ''will eat you alive''.
  64. *** For context, SkywardSword beat out games such as Arkham City, Assasin's Creed: Revelations, and Skyrim for the title, leading to huge masses of FanDumb complaining about how G4 had cheated in some way to make it win. Then the SS section of the award ceremony was spent essentially insulting SS and complaining about how it won even though it was a Nintendo game.
  65. * E3 2010:
  66. ** Microsoft dedicated half of their conference to Kinect (A.K.A Project Natal) which controlled questionably. A quarter of the conference was dedicated to features on Xbox Live that most gamer would probably never use and another quarter was used to showcase the games [[MisaimedFandom gamers actually care about]]. It was so bad that they had to [[BribingYourWayToVictory give everyone in the audience the new Xbox 360 model]].
  67. ** Ubisoft took the cake, however. They started off well showing gameplay for ''VideoGame/AssassinsCreedBrotherhood'', started to wobble a bit with Shaun White Skateboarding, got back in with Ghost Recon and Driver, then completely flew off the handle with the same Kinect game that was showcased in the Microsoft conference and a BREATHING GAME. There was a brief point of redemption with the return of {{Rayman}} in Rayman: Origins, with got quickly shot down with a MichaelJackson dancing game in the style of Just Dance. With no actual footage, just dancing. Cue {{Facepalm}}.
  68. ** Nintendo's conference overall was received rather well, especially in contrast to [[OldShame E3 2008]]. But no game has so polarized gamers as much as ''[[VideoGame/TheLegendOfZeldaSkywardSword Skyward Sword]]''. The graphical style, which is roughly a median between ''Wind Waker'' and ''VideoGame/TheLegendOfZeldaTwilightPrincess'', managed to irk the FanDumb the most, but there was also the supposedly wonky controls that were showcased by Miyamoto ([[MisBlamed due to wireless interference, what with all the journalists and their phones, computers, and cameras present]]). Fans are starting to lighten up a bit, however, now that they've seen and heard about the controls as they were ''intended'' to work, the streamlined item interface, and the [[SceneryPorn actually quite gorgeous impressionist-style world]].
  69. ** On that note, just say that Shigeru Miyamoto is anything but a video game legend who can do no wrong, and watch the fireworks explode.
  70. ** The game's motion controls are a point of [[BrokenBase debate]] with several fans. Are they just what Zelda needed after years of button mashing(or, in ''[[VideoGame/TheLegendOfZeldaTwilightPrincess Twilight Princess]]'' Wii's case, {{Waggle}}), and a return to the depth of ''VideoGame/ZeldaIITheAdventureOfLink's'' combat? Or are they needlessly clunky, and make the combat sluggish and [[FakeDifficulty needlessly difficult?]] There is no middle ground here.
  71. * Microsoft's 2012 E3 360 conference. Do you want 17 devices all running Xbox live at the same time? Do you want to watch a video on your Windows Tablet device while a song plays on your Windows Phone while your Xbox plays a game while your Internet Fridge is pre-ordering the next Halo game? Do you want to control all of these devices "Better With Kinect"? Post "Yes" on an gaming forum and expect to be destroyed by ''everyone''.
  72. * There have been arguments on whether VGChartz is a good place for software sales estimates. You do not mention these numbers on [=NeoGAF=]. ({{Wikipedia}} outright banned it.)
  73. ** For those who only care about American software sales, VGChartz vs [=NPD=]. Escpecially after a weekly sales update.
  74. * Gamespot decided to run a [[http://www.gamespot.com/greatest-video-game-hero/standings/index.html Greatest Game Hero]] popularity contest/tournament. The first round featured grossly biased matches pitting virtually unknown characters in this day and age against titans of popularity; e.g. Lester K. Chaykin of ''VideoGame/AnotherWorld'' vs. [[VideoGame/FinalFantasyVII Cloud Strife]], VideoGame/EarthwormJim vs. [[Franchise/TheLegendOfZelda Link]], and VideoGame/MegaMan vs. [[FinalFight Mike Haggar]]. When [[Franchise/{{Halo}} Master Chief]] vs. [[VideoGame/BubbleBobble Bub & Bob]] appeared for voting, members of [[ImageBoards The Imageboard That Should Not Be Namd]] (To be specific, /v/, /a/, and /b/) rallied together to turn it from 82-18 in MC's favor to 57:43 for Bub & Bob. Cue enough tears and whining to power the Internet for the rest of 2009. (They repeated the same feat against Franchise/SonicTheHedgehog, but considering the statement just below, it was ironically less controversial.)
  75. ** Later Gamespot cheated and flipped the votes between [[{{Metroid}} Samus]][=/=]B&B when B&B were winning thanks to the said imageboards; the tirade that ensued on the Gamespot forums were not light following this, just HINTING that Gamespot pulled a fast one caused week suspensions at the LEAST. Never talk about proxy voting on ANY character....
  76. ** Related was the Greatest Villain contest. Two of the four semi-finalists were [[TheForceUnleashed Darth Vader]] and [[ArkhamAsylum The Joker]], having crushed entries like {{Diablo}} and [[FinalFantasy Kefka]] on the way up. Half the community insisted they shouldn't be in the contest due to being Movie and ComicBook villains, while the other half defended the decision.
  77. ** And then that certain ImageBoard once again messed with the votes and allowed [[GearsOfWar General RAAM]], a very bland villain that hardly appeared in the game, to beat powerhouses like [[VideoGame/{{Half-Life 2}} Dr. Breen]] and [[VideoGame/FinalFantasyVII Sephiroth]].
  78. ** And now with the Greatest Sidekick contest, the ImageBoard succeeded in making the final battle one between [[WesternAnimation/DuckTales Launchpad McQuack]] and [[CommandAndConquerRedAlert Albert Einstein]], with Launchpad taking the win. Gamespot responded by taking the link to the polls off the front page in the semi-final round.
  79. * Similar to the above, The Escapists March Madness has attracted this for three years straight. It came to a very stupid peak when Zynga, creators of {{Farmville}}, were up against {{Valve}}, the site's collective (not so) secret crush. People began saying it was an atrocity that Zynga had made it this far, that they were cheating shamelessly by asking their fanbase to vote for them (despite Valve doing the same), and the page going to over 50,000 replies of people expressing their hatred of Zynga. And then people began posting on other forums that "Valve needed their help." Zynga were also accused of promising bribes to their players for votes... and ''that'' is genuinely against the rules. No such scenario, however, existed when the whole damn thing kicked up ''again'' the year after, when Mojang AB (Creators of {{Minecraft}}) won from a wild-card entry, beating Valve once again. The whining and flaming hit epic levels once more, even though this time nobody mounted a convincing argument that Mojang cheated in any way.
  80. * Related to that, the GameFAQs Contests Board ("Board 8") takes any tournament [[SeriousBusiness seriously]], from the GameFAQs Character Battles (annual tournaments similar to the Gamespot one) to "[[UltimateShowdownOfUltimateDestiny Most Powerful Character]] [[http://board8.wikia.com/wiki/Most_Powerful_Character_Contest Contests]]" done by the users themselves.
  81. ** For that matter, saying you post on GameFAQs will get you branded as mentally retarded.
  82. * IGN as game reviewers. Do they just whore out higher ratings for the big budget AAA titles regardless of actual merit, or are they fair in their judgments? For am especially sore point, bring up their review of Metro 2033. The reviewer went through the whole review sounding like he had rather enjoyed the game, which he stated was good but had a few issues. And then he suddenly slapped it with a 6, specifically stating poor stealth and glitches. To people who defend IGN, these would be justifiable reasons to mark a game down. To IGN doubters, these are just excuses to mark down a great game.
  83. ** It doesn't help that the premier Call of Duty, Halo, Battlefield, and Gears of War games are almost exclusively the only games to have 9's and higher. or even are the only games or series to routinely score high 8's and above.
  84. ** Every time IGN makes an article bashing Nintendo (or saying that a different game or console is superior), there will '''always''' be a FlameWar between [[FanDumb the more aggressive section]] of Nintendo's fandom and anyone who supports the article (logically or [[HateDumb not]]).
  85. * The [[http://knowyourmeme.com/memes/events/paul-christoforo-ocean-marketing-emails Paul Christoforo/Ocean Marketing incident.]] The CEO of a marketing firm responds to a confused customer because a certain product didn't make the release date on time, and by responding [[JerkAss we mean openly ridiculing him for his supposed impatience despite clear mismanagement on his part, using language you'd expect from a GameFAQs troll.]] Thanks to the email exchange being posted by [[PennyArcade Mike Krahulik]] online, the backdraft was immense enough to practically destroy the firm, getting them fired by the company producing the product, and people quickly finding out that Paul has a history of terrible customer service, [[LaserGuidedKarma which makes this backlash even more satisfying.]]
  86. * Even video game strategy guide companies come under fire. Who's better? Brady Games or Prima Games? Flame wars often erupt over this argument.
  87. * Just bring up the NintendoPower magazine anywhere you go. Expect everyone to call it biased and how it ain't what it used to be.
  88. * Michael Pachter. An [[SmallNameBigEgo egotistical]] "analyst" that's frequently [[EpicFail totally wrong]](and fully aware of it) but still holds a job, or a knowledgeable fellow with an interesting view on the industry? Whatever you do, bringing him up around Nintendo fans isn't advised.
  89. * Try and bring up SeanMalstrom on a Nintendo fansite, especially a {{Metroid}}-based one. The flames will be bright enough to be seen from space. For toastier results, say anything even remotely positive about his views.
  90. * [[{{Woolseyism}} Ted Woolsey]]. You either hate him for his horrible scripts that ruined the purity of the Japanese games, or you hate people that can't grasp Ted Woolsey made his games far greater than any mere Japanese developer could crreate. No, you may not suggest that the scripts were good for their time and hold up well, but could have been improved on if he'd had more time and storage space, ''even if Ted Woolsey himself says so.''
  91. * Similarly, Victor Ireland either massacred ''{{Lunar}}'' with Clinton and fart jokes or salvaged a stupid generic JRPG and is the true father of ''Lunar''. Since Ireland himself falls into the latter camp and remains ''extremely'' bitter that XSEED did not hire his new company when they licensed and localized the PSP EnhancedPort, this gets ugly ''really'' fast since there's a good chance he may show up and egg people on.
  92. * Controversial game reviewers get this at times, especially ones that invoke EightPointEight.
  93. [[/folder]]
  94.  
  95. [[folder:Specific Games]]
  96. * Say Franchise/SonicTheHedgehog's '''mere name''' ''anywhere on the Internet.''
  97. ** For some considerable time after ''VideoGame/SonicAdventure2'', whether Shadow had been KilledOffForReal or not was one of these issues. Now the problem is [[SpotlightStealingSquad whether or]] [[JumpingTheShark not he]] [[TheyWastedAPerfectlyGoodPlot should]] [[DarkerAndEdgier have been...]]
  98. ** Mention ''anything'' about the 3D Sonic games, and watch the natter build up.
  99. ** ForMassiveDamage, attest that you found [[TheScrappy Chris Thorndyke]] (from the SonicX anime) to be a well-rounded and likeable character ''throughout'' his two-season run.
  100. ** Or ask whether it's Eggman or Robotnik. Check the section on Birdo's gender for the likely responses.
  101. ** Need some [[VideoGame/SonicTheHedgehog2006 Flames of Disaster]] yourself? Say anything positive about the old 4Kids voice actors (other than MikePollock or '''DanGreen'''), bonus points if you say that Jason Griffith was better than Ryan Drummond and Roger Craig Smith combined. Watch the usually passive Adventure fans and the modern fans ''tear each other apart''.
  102. ** Also talk about your favorite shipping and say why all others are wrong. [[ShipToShipCombat Sonamy vs Shadamy and Knuxouge vs Shadouge]] are highly popular debate topics.
  103. ** Heck, just saying you don't like a character will get you into trouble. Depending on the character of course. Then there are the characters that saying you ''like'' them will get you in trouble.
  104. ** In terms of the fanbase, mentioning a potential "Sonic Adventure 3" idea will just get swarms of people going off on one about how Sonic 2006 was basically Adventure 3 in all but name, that Adventure 3 would have the alternate gameplay styles people don't like, and that it's just a title anyway.
  105. *** Hell, you don't technically even need to say "Sonic Adventure 3" to [[BerserkButton tick anti-Adventure fans off]]. Two words you NEVER want to say around them: [[ScrappyMechanic Chao]] [[RidiculouslyCuteCritter Garden]].
  106. ** Say that ''VideoGame/SonicGenerations'' is better than ''VideoGame/Sonic3AndKnuckles'' or vice-versa.
  107. *** Or TakeAThirdOption and say ''VideoGame/SonicAdventure2'' is better than either of them.
  108. ** And of course, the ongoing [[VideoGame/SonicTheHedgehog C]][[VideoGame/SonicTheHedgehog2 la]][[VideoGame/SonicCD ss]][[Videogame/Sonic3AndKnuckles ic]] vs. [[VideoGame/SonicAdventure Adv]][[VideoGame/SonicAdventure2 ent]][[VideoGame/SonicHeroes ure]] vs. [[VideoGame/SonicTheHedgehog2006 The]] [[VideoGame/SonicUnleashed newer]] [[VideoGame/SonicColors ga]][[VideoGame/SonicGenerations mes]] debate. No matter what side you're on, you'll have the other two sides spewing flames against you so hot, [[PlayingWithFire Blaze the Cat]] would blush.
  109. ** Merely mention the [[VideoGame/SonicTheHedgehog the]] [[VideoGame/SonicTheHedgehog2 Classic]] [[VideoGame/SonicCD Sonic]] [[VideoGame/Sonic3AndKnuckles games]] and [[SonicTheHedgehog4 Sonic the Hedgehog 4]] in the same sentence. Bonus points if you try defending the [[ContestedSequel lat]][[TheyChangedItSoItSucks ter]] or even insist it as a superior game over it's predesssors. That alone should spark a holocaust between fans of the classic Sonic games and fans of Sonic 4 (especially if the most elite of both sides are involved, who depending on which side they're on condemn any praise or criticism of the game) so intense, you'd need to borrow a [[Sonic3AndKnuckles Fire Shield]] just to avoid getting charred in the process.
  110. * Need to get a really big flame going for a barbecue you're planning? Just follow this simple 3-step-process:
  111. ## Go to the [[http://www.nma-fallout.com/forum/ No Mutants Allowed Forum]].
  112. ## Post any remotely positive comment about ''VideoGame/{{Fallout 3}}''.
  113. ## You'll have a fine meal in no time.
  114. ** Similarly, posting anything about the console game ''Brotherhood of Steel''.
  115. *** Back when the above game was in production, Interplay shut down ''their own official forums'' for the game due to being filled by angry posts.
  116. * When discussing ''VideoGame/SuperSmashBros'', the quickest way to annoy a lot of people is to debate either the use of items in tournaments, or [[TournamentPlay wave-dashing]].
  117. ** Or admitting you play as Pikachu. See [[http://www.penny-arcade.com/comic/2008/02/22 this ''Penny Arcade'' comic]] and accompanying blog post.
  118. ** Another one is to mention that ''Wolf,'' is [[{{Shotoclone}} too clone-y]] of ''Falco,'' who is too clone-y of Fox, and that previous characters that were removed should've replaced this triple-clone. You'll get a pretty nice battle going: might even result in some Soylent Snacks for the show.
  119. ** Don't forget the classic phrase: [[MemeticMutation No items. Fox only. Final Destination.]]
  120. ** To many fans, "I like Brawl better than Melee" translates to "I am a huge faggot, please re-educate me on what games I'm supposed to play and not play."
  121. ** There's also the problem of who should be the fifth rep for the ''Mario'' series in the fourth game, or if it even needs one.
  122. ** Series reps in general. [[SchmuckBait Go on]], say "X character should get in over Y", "X should be cut," and the all time favorite, "X should be in!" [[hottip:*:'' No [[VideoGame/MegaManX not that X]], though he has been requested'']] Bonus points if you substitute X for any unlikely 3rd-party character like [[KingdomHearts Sora]].
  123. ** ''Say that [[ScrappyMechanic tripping]] in Brawl was a fair and well-implemented mechanic''. If you make it out without 3rd degree burns then you are one lucky guy/gal.
  124. * The moral ramifications of fighting Nobodies and Organization XIII in ''[[KingdomHearts Kingdom Hearts II]]''. WhatMeasureIsANonHuman in general evokes this, but this gets it a lot in particular as you spend the first three hours of the game ''playing as one''.
  125. ** Oh, and how about this, [[ShipToShipCombat go on a forum and ask 'so liek does Sora mac on Kairi or Riku or whut gaiz?']]
  126. ** Ohohoho~ Be sure to bring up the topic of [[VideoGame/KingdomHearts358DaysOver2 Xion]], ''Kingdom Hearts''' biggest BaseBreaker, on a popular [=KH=] forum. Then call her a [[MarySue Xarmy Sue]]. Be sure to wear your heat-resistant protective gear!
  127. ** More recently in ''BirthBySleep'', we have the villain Vanitas who is revealed to be a ''seventh'' [[spoiler:Sora]] clone (if those numbers are crunched correctly...). Nomura is officially on thin ice, alongside half of the fanbase...
  128. ** Go to a Kingdom Hearts forum (ESPECIALLY KH Insider) and post a simple topic of, "Why do people hate Kairi?" Sit back and watch as a freaking ''cult'' of people say she's a bitchy, obsessive Sora fangirl that hates Riku, exists to only be a DistressedDamsel, and that Namine and/or Xion are 10x better. Some even have the latter part in their ''signature''.
  129. *** Similarly, creating a topic like that regarding Xion and expect a similar response.
  130. ** Oh, talk about the Disney portion ... especially upon talking upon various villains that should appear (i.e. [[Disney/BeautyAndTheBeast Gaston]], [[Disney/ThePrincessAndTheFrog Facilier]], [[Disney/TheJungleBook Shere Khan]]) ... you get bitched out by a bunch of Kingdom Hearts fans saying that that portion is stupid. While at the same time, you get Disney fans who bitch saying that Kingdom Hearts fails at representing Disney correctly.
  131. *** Wanna see some fireworks? Make an argument whether or not Gaston should've appeared in the Kingdom Hearts series or not (A Heartless monster took his place).
  132. ** Say you find any of the sequels/spin-offs to be better than [[FirstInstallmentWins the]] [[VideoGame/KingdomHearts first]], or vice-versa on any given forum dedicated to the KH series. I. Dare. You.
  133. * Want to start a fight ''anywhere on the Internet''? Just go to any forum and say something, ''anything'' about ''GuitarHero''. Sooner or later, somebody will bitch about how ''GuitarHero'' players are posers [[StopHavingFunGuys who should learn how to play a real guitar]], and then you'll have yourself a nice, toasty flame war to warm your tootsies.
  134. ** {{VG Cats}} once [[http://www.vgcats.com/comics/?strip_id=230 took a jab at it]]. Though, Scott Ramsoomair was actually making fun of people believing they could actually play guitar from playing ''Guitar Hero''.
  135. ** Guess what? RockBand 3 will have a real guitar that will teach you to play properly.
  136. *** Which is already starting to generate some backdraft from guitarists pointing out that plucking the string and knowing what fret to press isn't that much less superficial than the older controllers.
  137. ** Not to mention the ongoing argument about whether ''Guitar Hero'' or ''RockBand'' is the better plastic instrument simulator series, which has been going on since the latter made its debut in 2007 and shows no signs of abating.
  138. *** Say anything -- '''anything''' -- about two certain other {{Rhythm Game}}s to fans of ''Guitar Hero'' or ''Rock Band''. Or vice versa.
  139. ** Any discussion of [[{{Nirvana}} Kurt Cobain's]] likeness in ''Guitar Hero 5''. Is the game honoring him or standing against everything he (supposedly) stood for by including a virtual replica of him? Is witnessing him singing completely asinine songs just plain wrong or [[CrossesTheLineTwice humorous in a sick way]]? Is Courtney Love a whore for lending his likeness to Activision? (On a side note, the late JohnnyCash was also subjected to the same treatment as Kurt in ''[=GH5=]'', yet there was much less outcry over his avatar. Nirvana FanDumb much?)
  140. ** Hyperspeed in Guitar Hero and its Rock Band counterpart, Breakneck Speed. The increased speed leads to notes being spread further apart, which some people find makes it easier to play. Now go to a message board and say that it's cheating.
  141. ** Having trouble getting your campfire started? Go onto a Rock Band forum, and try to imply that there's a good reason for HMX to be reselling older tracks with keyboards and harmonies. You'll be roasting marshmallows and weenies in no time.
  142. * ''FinalFantasy'' fans are very rabid in their opinions over which games are the best in the series. To the point where every time a new entry is announced, there's practically a race to see who's going to be the first to declare it the worst in the series, then immediately devolve into a flamewar over whether they should wait for the game to actually come out before they make such bold pronouncements. Also volatile are debates over the original 2D entries versus the later 3D entries starting with ''VideoGame/FinalFantasyVII''.
  143. ** You know that UrbanLegendOfZelda about FinalFantasyIV stating that Palom and Porom can be revived? Or the one about FinalFantasyVI stating that Leo can be revived and can join your party after you permanently revive him? Yeah, don't ask about it on the forums.
  144. ** Although fairly obvious once you think about it, any comment making fun of the way FinalFantasy characters look, with a common one being that Cloud [[DudeLooksLikeALady looks like a lady]], is going to get you some action from the firebrands on the forum, though seasoned fans have heard it before and will dismiss it as trolling.
  145. ** Other topics to avoid are "Who was the best villain?" and "Who's responsible for Sephiroth's actions?"
  146. ** Say you like ''VideoGame/FinalFantasyVIII''. For more kindling, try saying that on ThatGuyWithTheGlasses or TheSpoonyExperiment.
  147. *** Hey, ThatDudeInTheSuede likes the game and he's a part of TGWTG.
  148. ** Call [[VideoGame/FinalFantasyVIII Squall Leonhart]] by any other name like [[SpellMyNameWithAnS Squall Lionheart]] or [[GannonBanned Leon Loire]] to any true fans of the series and see what happens.
  149. ** The announcement during E3 2008 that ''VideoGame/FinalFantasyXIII'', previously a Playstation 3 exclusive title, would also be coming to the Xbox 360.
  150. *** And now that the game is out, saying you have any opinion on it, good or bad, will cause you to be attacked by half of the broken base. For extra spicyness, say you think its bad, and that all of the problems of it are because it went to the 360, and if it stayed exclusive it would be a much better game.
  151. ** There's really four types of FF fans: the new fans, the fans who claim the series ended with ''VideoGame/FinalFantasyIX'' or ''VideoGame/FinalFantasyX'', the fans who claim the series ended with ''VideoGame/FinalFantasyVI'', and the ones who ignore the crazies and just enjoy the games.
  152. *** Except those people who just "enjoy the games" will also eventually become part of the fire after playing them, returning to their respective "FF lair" and inevitably taking a side in any discussion that compares "FF Exhibit A vs FF Exhibit B", praises or bashes the FF sacrificial lamb in turn (one of these being the last iteration they played or care the most about). Man, FinalFantasy fandom is so much fun overall...
  153. ** While we are on the subject, ''never ever'' mention FinalFantasyX2 if there are hardcore FFX fans around. They don't take it well. Granted, not a lot of people take it well. Don't even think about saying it's fun.
  154. ** ''Never'' bring up [[FinalFantasyTacticsAdvance Marche]]. It will inevitably cause heated arguments about the morality of his actions, or whether he's [[AlternateCharacterInterpretation actually the villain]].
  155. ** Never tell anyone that you were happy about [[spoiler:Aeris' death]]. You will be flamed to eternity.
  156.  
  157. * [[SpellMyNameWithAnS Aeris vs. Aerith]] on any site where ''VideoGame/FinalFantasyVII'' may be discussed in any capacity. It's especially annoying because you can't even ''mention'' the character without starting a fight. Even TheOtherWiki had to kowtow to the fighting and spell it ''both'' ways, but the wars still continue.
  158. ** Also, [[ShipToShipCombat Aerith vs. Tifa]]. No more need be said.
  159. * ''VideoGame/FinalFantasyXI'' and [[GameMod Windower]]. The amount of heat generated from the flames about whether it's legit or not has enough heat to rival the ''sun''.
  160. ** Want to really light things up? Bring up [[NighInvulnerable Absolute Virtue]], and say he actually ''is'' beatable outside of the now-defunct methods. The forum will then implode, collapsing on itself through sheer whining.
  161. ** Both of these no longer work. Windower is now widely accepted as legitimate, and the community is getting closer to killing Absolute Virtue. In particular, one team managed to get him below half health, and has found out how to stop his most problematic abilities. There are still a few things that need to be found out, but it looks like the legendary AV may be coming down.
  162. * Want to brew a huge FlameWar between ''{{Metroid}}'' and/or Nintendo fans? Talk about ''MetroidPrime 1'', 2, 3, or Hunters, and talk about whether you think the games are a first person ''shooter'' or first person ''adventure''. Be sure to mention what Nintendo's stance is on the genre for more flaming action.
  163. ** Any mention of ''Hunters'' seems to have that effect.
  164. ** Ditto any mention of ''OtherM'', ''especially'' the Ridley cutscene.
  165. ** For more flaming, tell everyone that you think Metroid should have more multiplayer and online.
  166. ** [[GannonBanned "Is]] [[IAmNotShazam Metroid Prime's]] [[ArmCannon gun attached to]] [[SamusIsAGirl his]] [[GannonBanned arm or suit?"]]
  167. ** Another fun one. Go to any gaming website, and suggest a match-up between Samus and [[Franchise/{{Halo}} Master Chief]]. For better results, give your argument supporting one or the other, then kick back and roast marshmallows on the flames.
  168. ** Here's a [[BlatantLies great idea]]: go onto any Metroid forum and say that SuperMetroid is anything less than perfect. The flames will fly.
  169. * Saying anything positive about the plot in ''VideoGame/WorldOfWarcraft'' on a ''VideoGame/{{Warcraft}}'' fan-forum.
  170. ** For bonus points, mention RichardKnaak, or the [[WorldOfWarcraftComic comics]].
  171. ** Or for that matter, arguing the relative merits of [=PvE=] and [=PvP=] in ''[[strike:VideoGame/WorldOfWarcraft]]'' any [=MMORPG=].
  172. ** Or try admitting you're one of the many millions of people that plays [=WoW=] on the chat channels or forums of some other [=MMOs=], and you may as well have posted "I poop delicious cinnamon buns, while your dandruff is anthrax" for the way people will react to it.
  173. ** As for those who care about lore, say anything about the Horde or the Alliance (but mainly the Horde) that paints them as anything but glittering saints incapable of evil, and you'll likely be slammed with threats to your health, [[GodwinsLaw comparisons to Hitler]] and [[SeriousBusiness death threats]] by the opposing side.
  174. ** Want to make Smokey Bear very sad? Go to a Warcraft fan site and say anything that contradicts the notion that Sylvanas is the deepest, most well written and well developed character in the established lore.
  175. *** Every single day on some forum, someone complains about the lack of a third playable faction that is neutral, or begs for the ability to have their Horde/Alliance character pledge allegiance to the opposing faction. Every single time, it ends in flame wars and tears. If it's an RP forum, expect MarySue accusations.
  176. ** And don't even get started on which classes are overpowered or underpowered, or the "broken" state of PVP arenas which apparently makes them favor one side over the other...
  177. ** In actuality, all one has to do to start an InternetBackdraft is to go on the forums and mention [[UnpleasableFanbase anything positive about the game or the developers in general]].
  178. ** In-game, as a Horde player, in the low-to-mid-level zone known as The Barrens, simply ask the simple quest-related question in General Chat: "Where is Mankrik's Wife?" HilarityEnsues.
  179. ** If the game's official forums are to be believed, EVERYONE who plays the game hates it, EVERY change made is bad and is cause to cancel your account (no matter how minor it may be) and of course, EVERY class is simultaneously overpowered, underpowered and fine how it is.
  180. ** The Celestial Steed incident, where Blizzard released a mount for sale in the cash shop. The premise of the game's financial model means that players should not be able to pay to gain an advantage over other players. The mount cost $25/£17, and was sent to all characters on the purchaser's account through the in-game mail. The resulting explosion on the forums rivalled Eyjafjallajokull in severity. The mount is now called That Retarded Horse, or TRH for short, thanks to the EU {{troll}} (in a number of ways) Totalbiscuit, who very suddenly disappeared from the forums a week or so later.
  181. ** While the [=RealID=] feature, a Battle.net service offering players who trade their account info such as email and their real name improved means of communication while playing recent games made by BlizzardEntertainment, has been a very touchy subject due to the personal info required for its use, it was always optional and thus not really something to get worked up about. But when Blizzard [[http://forums.worldofwarcraft.com/thread.html?topicId=25712374700&sid=1&pageNo=1 announced]] that the [[http://forums.battle.net/thread.html?topicId=25626109041 service would eventually be made mandatory in order to make new posts on their forums]]... The playerbase, naturally, ''[[WhatWereYouThinking exploded]]''. [[http://forums.worldofwarcraft.com/thread.html?topicId=25968987278&sid=1 The change has since been revoked after three days of wild rage.]] And the fandom rejoices.
  182. *** The [[http://forums.worldofwarcraft.com/thread.html?topicId=25712374700&sid=1 backlash]] was epic in proportions. It hit about 300 pages within around 5 hours of the original post. Within a day, it had over 1500 pages (it currently has almost 2500 pages, with an additional 700 pages in its sister thread on the European forums). The previous record for a long thread in the WoW forums seems to have been something around 400 pages. Not only this, but several [[http://blogs.wsj.com/digits/2010/07/07/real-names-rile-online-warlocks-and-wizards/# news]] [[http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/technology/10543100.stm websites]] decided the uproar was worth a story. To top it all off, a Blizzard employee, community manager Bashiok, posted his own full name as a show of good faith, and was quickly hunted down IRL and harassed ''mercilessly'' by irate players. Blizzard employees have since been made exempt from the changes, citing "[[DoubleStandard privacy]] concerns".
  183. **** [[http://us.battle.net/wow/en/forum/topic/2548785589 RealID Fiasco, take 2.]] In May 2011, Blizzard announced they were developing a feature that allows the ability to group in the Random Dungeon Finder with your RealID friends as a "premium feature" (i.e. Paying an extra fee on top of the monthly subscription). The announcement of this feature has come on the heels of the news that World of Warcraft lost 600k subscriptions from January to March 2011 and has been almost universally panned by the playerbase, most of whom feel this feature is a quick cash grab to make up for the lost subscriptions.
  184. ** A couple years ago, Blizzard fanart section included a picture by [[LasLindas Chalosan]] of a naked female tauren hugging a lion. The pic caused quite a bit of controversy on the forums over whether or not it should have been allowed. Blizzard ultimately removed the image a few days later, which caused another surge of threads about whether it should have been removed. Chalo later admitted he submitted the picture [[ItAmusedMe just to see whether it would be admitted]].
  185. *** Controversy has cropped up again in May 2012 in relation to a picture of a female Worgen eating a dragon burger, comparing it the previously mentioned nude female picture. Backlash has even gone so far as to condemn other "sexual" pictures after its removal.
  186. ** Just mention Gearscore in trade chat or on the official forums and everyone experiences intense butthurt.
  187. ** Since Blizzcon 2010, where the Blizzard developers made several jokes at the expense of Alliance players (but also got owned by [[http://www.wowpedia.org/Red_Shirt_Guy one in particular]] during a Q & A session), there have been several threads popping up on the official forums about Horde favoritism and how it seems to be reflected in-game; most notably with the development time Goblins got in comparison to the Worgen and how Horde quests seem to be better designed that their Alliance counterparts. The debate had gotten so heated, a "Horde bias" page was created at Wowpedia as a joke; eventually, the page took on a life of its own and got deleted due to butthurt Horde fanboys taking it seriously and vandalizing it.
  188. *** This issue came up again at Blizzcon 2011. After a largely apologetic Blizzard made concessions to cater towards both factions at this year's event, Samwise Didler introduced "Corpsegrinder", the lead singer of Cannibal Corpse, as the "unofficial ambassador of the Horde" and played a video clip of Corpsegrinder that was little more than of him saying a string of homophobic insults towards Alliance players and telling Alliance to commit suicide. This stirred people into a frenzy that it led to people being attacked for showing their Alliance pride. Community manager Bashiok tried to pass it off as being "Just a joke, not to be taken seriously", which made matters worse; since then, they have been threatened with multiple lawsuits, as well as being reported to the homosexual rights committee (as some lawyers would note, they actually do have a good case against them). Both Samwise Didier and Blizzard President Mike Morhaime (separately) released apologies to the community for the conduct at Blizzcon.
  189. ** Go to the official forums and mention that you ''like'' the worgen female models. Alternatively, mention ''anything at all'' about Sylvanas and the Forsaken's rights to Lordaeron, and make sure to derail a completely unrelated thread by doing so. The bonfires will last for weeks.
  190. ** Ever since Blizzard decided to try making 10 man and 25 man raids equally difficult and rewarding so that people may focus on just one size at a time, bringing up concerns on the official forums about either size will often end up with members that raid either size flaming each other viciously. Popular opinions are that whatever they're not raiding is lots easier (seemingly [[ItsEasysoItSucks faceroll]] from the overall difficulty of encounters, but also the logistic aspects)and saying that 25 man raiding is the only [[BiggerIsBetter real size anyway]](so the privileges are obvious), so 10 man raiders can bite themselves.
  191. ** [[BrokenBase Garrosh]]. [[CreatorsPet Hellscream]]. Picking either side of the arguement will end poorly for you as you contest if he's in the right to be an AxCrazy BloodKnight, or if his warmongering is leading the Horde to be [[StopBeingStereotypical Violent and dumb like every other orcish race in fiction.]] It dosen't help that Blizzard initially leaned torwards the supporters for some time, and actually tried to develop him as a character, then decided to give it up and lean wholly torwards the haters by making him the BigBad of the upcoming expansion.
  192. ** For some time, the issue of Arthas' fate has been a major point of contention for many Warcraft fans, with the flame war going on between whether Arthas [[HeelFaceTurn should be redeemed]] or shouldn't and deserves to die. For some time, up till patch 3.3 you could go on any Warcraft fourm and claim that a)you want to see Arthas redeemed or b) there's still good in him, you'll get people calling this out for [[TrueArtIsAngsty being "unrealistic"]] and somehow [[GodwinsLaw make an analogy]] to RealLife on [[HitlerAteSugar "infamous historical dictator x" had good traits but still died unrepentant or paid for his crimes]]. It dosen't help that both of these groups have exaggerated or unrealistic points-----------many of the people who wanted Arthas to be redeemed did not want a simple RedemptionEqualsDeath but instead, a RedemptionEarnsLife where he is fully absolved of his crimes, and the people that don't call out those who do for not "playing Warcraft 3" and tend to not see the complex reasons surronding Arthas FaceHeelTurn the fact that it was his devotion to his kingdom that caused him to turn this way in the first place. Blizzard's solution was to compromise with a DeathEqualsRedemption for Arthas for 3.3, and the debate has since died down, but even then there are those who claim it was "sugar coating the bad side" or "did not do much to truly redeem him". It also dosen't help that the model that those who want to see Arthas redeemed was also a major BaseBreaker in [[StarWars the series that he appeared in]].
  193. ** Faction Favoritism posts, in fact it's become a meme due to the simple fact that it inevitably becomes a flame war and that there are insane amounts of {{Imagine Spot}}s where one side is eliminated, insults to Garrosh Hellscream/[[AntiHero Varian Wrynn]], ideas that Blizzard favors one faction (Alliance/Horde), Cries about how [[BecomingTheMask "their"]] race is under-represented in lore, [[OnlySaneMan people]] who tell the others to shut up, and other people who tell the previous group that it's just hopeless.
  194. ** Go to a video related to Burning Crusade or classic content and say you liked anything in Wrath of the Lich King or started when it was the newest expansion (Cataclysm counts to a lesser degree). You will then be derided as a "Wrath baby" who does not have the skill or dedication for raiding.
  195. ** Try calling the ''Mists of Pandaria'' expansion and Pandaren race a rip-off of ''KungFuPanda'' and watch the fireworks. The Pandaren were [[OlderThanTheyThink actually introduced in Warcraft III]] with the addition of Chen Stormstout as a neutral hero.
  196. * VideoGame/TheLordOfTheRingsOnline has always had a backdraft regarding Eagle/Flying Mounts. A forum member will start a thread stating their opinion that the ability to fly Eagles around Middle-Earth in some form would be a great feature. It does not matter whether they suggest free-roaming flight, scripted flight path travel or storyline only flashbacks. Fans of Tolkien's Lore will flock to the thread denouncing the idea, quoting source material, demonstrating how it would be impossible/difficult to program, and providing links to numerous threads in which the Developers have flat out said that they have no intention of introducing Flying Mounts. More gameplay minded forummers will weigh in arguing that the Lore should not get in the way of fun, that new code can be written and that the developers could always change their minds in the future.
  197. ** [[WordOfGod "The Eagles of Manwe are not a taxi service."]]
  198. ** Even if the forummer who mentioned Flying Mounts did so amongst many, many other good ideas for LotRO, those ideas will be ignored and the Flying Mount will become the sole focus of discussion.
  199. ** After LotRO introduced the Free2Play system, the influx of new players unfamiliar with the long history of the Flying Mount flame wars has lead to a spike in threads suggesting their introduction.
  200. ** Similar to the Flying Mount debate, players have suggested LotRO servers introduce PvP and [=PvMP=] combat to all zones. The results are similar to the Flying Mount suggestions.
  201. * The practice of snaking in ''VideoGame/MarioKart DS''. Snaking is the usage of multiple power-slides across straightaways in order to move faster. Essentially an exploit in the DS version, which led to multiple wars over whether it was actually cheating or mastery of the game engine.
  202. ** Nintendo has even poked the hornet's nest a few times. Once with an official expressing surprise at the controversy (and claiming the technique worked as designed), and again with the announcement that power slides had been [[{{Nerf}} reworked]] in the engine for ''Mario Kart Wii'' to prevent snaking. This led to flame wars that once more pitted snakers against non-snakers, only this time over whether the game was being [[TheyChangedItNowItSucks deliberately dumbed down]] or whether an exploit had been patched.
  203. ** Abusing glitches in Mario Kart to finish a race faster than you're supposed to. Intended or falls under the same vein as cheating? You'll never get an answer out of anyone as the flames from the debate are hot enough to melt the polar ice caps.
  204. *** This had grown worse in Mario Kart 7 when several tracks were discovered having glitches in the checkpoint system (determines where you are placed back on track if you go out of bounds) that allowed people to skip big chunks of the track. When Nintendo was pressed to respond to the problem, they said that they ''could'' release a patch, but doing so would give some players an "unfair advantage", meaning that at the time they apparently thought the only way to fix the problem would be to recall the game and print up a new version. It wasn't until a few months later, after Nintendo had decided to get into the DownloadableContent business, that Nintendo actually enforced a downloadable patch to fix the problems and barred people without it from playing online.
  205. ** "Snaking" also occurred in ''VideoGame/{{F-Zero}} GX'' / ''F-Zero AX'' (the latter being essentially an arcade version of the former), and possibly the other 3D games in the series. In fact, the term was used in reference to ''F-Zero'' first, and imported into ''VideoGame/MarioKart'' discussions.
  206. ** "Permanent Rocket Boosting" (PRB'ing), also in ''VideoGame/MarioKart DS''. A trick/glitch found where someone could keep the boost start going indefinitely by constantly mini turboing (and not lose speed off road as a weird result), this caused the same kind of flame wars among tournament level players as snaking did among everyone else (some record sites banned it, some allowed it, etc). ''VideoGame/MarioKart'' fans seem to always have ''something'' to complain about.
  207. * Go to any ''Franchise/{{Halo}}'' forum and bring up the pistol. Bring your [[strike:fire]]pistol-retardant suit.
  208. ** Be careful when critiquing ''Franchise/{{Halo}}'''s plot: some fans will let a few things slide, but a single use of ''cliche'' as a descriptor will set the forum on fire.
  209. ** Never, ever point out that Sergeant Johnson died in the first game and his death was retconned because, frankly, Sergeant Johnson is awesome. It doesn't matter if you are criticizing the plot or just simply stating it as a fact. You will get long rants about Project Orion and Spartan-I's and other plot points that are never, ever mentioned in the games, barring Johnson's "classified" handwave.
  210. * Just try and ask whether Cranky Kong and Wrinkly Kong are VideoGame/DonkeyKong's parents or grandparents. Also, whether the Donkey Kong that fought Mario was Donkey or a younger Cranky.
  211. ** This is especially ridiculous when you consider that official media that was around when the original game was released explicitly state that Cranky is Donkey's father and that Cranky is the one who threw barrels at Mario.
  212. *** It's not really that ridiculous when you consider that in the ending of Donkey Kong Country 2 after you rescue Donkey Kong, Cranky says something along the lines of "You've saved that lazy '''grandson''' of mine", and ever since many people have been understandably confused on the matter.
  213. * Anything related to Enhancement Diversification or the Global Defense Reduction used to be backdraft material in ''CityOfHeroes''. Those wounds seem to have mended since boosts to player enhancement power. Continuing hot buttons are insistence on a traditional "Healer/Tank/Damage" structure in teams, as well as the increasing role of super-super "Incarnates" in game lore.
  214. * [[FireEmblem "Who are Roy and Lilina's mothers in Fuuin no Tsurugi?"]]. Or any such variant.
  215. ** ''[[VideoGame/FireEmblemTellius Fire Emblem: Radiant Dawn]]''. Go to any forum and bring up the issue of Ike's sexuality. Bring marshmallows to toast around the fire.
  216. ** Go to any forum and bring up Micaiah. Inevitably, someone will bash. Just as inevitably, someone will retort with how interestingly conflicted her character is. (Sometimes, you get the bonus of someone comparing her to Ike, which then devolves into Ike's Sexuality territory.) FireEmblemAwakening added layers of TheyChangedItNowItSucks...more to Micaiah with her HotterAndSexier DLC Art.
  217. ** That's barely the tip of the iceberg. FireEmblemAwakening has brought its own shipwars ''even from before it's released''. The main topics are: [[spoiler: Ike's descendant]] Paris, and whether [[KickingAssInAllHerFinery the]] [[BowAndSwordInAccord Bride]] [[WhiteMage class]] is horribly unfeminist and offensive or a CombatMedic-like class with ActionFashionista bonus. Particularly if we see that [[VideoGame/FireEmblemTheSacredStones Eirika's]] DLC class is this one, which adds to her WhatMeasureIsANonBadass hatedom.
  218. ** Go to a ''[[FireEmblemJugdral Seisen no Keifu]]'' forum, mention Beowulf even once, and watch the fans vs. the haters drag the threads out for at least 5 pages before the wank dies down.
  219. *** Earrrgh... Lachesis is constantly called a slut by the fanbase. To make this a short deal: talking about any possible Lachesis pairings is a GREAT flame war in the making. Don't ask, it's for you own good.
  220. ** Discuss the criteria you use to pair ''any'' of the Seisen girls. Do you prefer to think of the stats their children will get in Gen 2? Or do you pair them according to their and their beaus's stories and personalities? Don't tell your "secret" to anyone. And if you do... good luck surviving the upcoming flame war.
  221. ** [[FlameWar "YOU SERIOUSLY USE RHYS?! WHAT THE HELL ARE YOU THINKING? YOU SHOULD SPEND ALL YOUR BONUS EXP ON MIST BECAUSE SHE GETS A C IN STAVES WHEN SHE PROMOTES! PEGASUS KNIGHTS ARE USELESS! YOU SHOULD BE INVESTING YOUR TIME IN WYVERN LORDS, THEIR DEFENCES ARE GREATER! YOU USE *ISADORA*?! ARE YOU **SICK**?!"]]
  222. ** Lyn's true pairing has been a case of FlameWar for some time. Hector has all the SlapSlapKiss and acting like a married couple, not to mention the "Respite in Battle" conversation. Rath's only pairing is with Lyn, and he's the father of Sue from FE 6... and then she looks like ''both'' of them. Kent is her devoted knight, and [[LadyAndKnight knight/princess pairings]] are super popular in FireEmblem. And are we forgetting [[RedHeadedHero Eliwood]] and [[LesYay Florina]], by the way?) Then come the Smash Bros. Ike fangirls...
  223. ** Eliwood's true pairing, too. You like him with Ninian? You're an antifeminist and a MarySue supporter. You like him with Lyn? You're one of "these feminists" who think she's entitled to his cock just for being an ActionGirl. You like him with Hector? Eeeeew, gay cooties. You like him with Fiora? ... Fiora WHO?
  224. * Go on an ''[[VideoGame/TheElderScrolls Elder Scrolls]]'' forum and ask about CHIM. The results are especially interesting because almost no side in that argument has more than one supporter.
  225. ** Similarly, go to a lore-oriented ''Elder Scrolls'' forum and bring up Sithis. Such topics usually have their posters split into multiple camps with conflicting conclusions on what Sithis actually ''is''.
  226. ** Criticize Morrowind (beyond graphics)in TES general.
  227. ** Outside "lore" questions, how about that voice acting, eh?
  228. ** Avoid speaking about Skyrim at RPG Codex at all costs.
  229. ** Just attempt to say "I don't like Elder Scrolls" at Reddit's /r/gaming subforum. This troper bids you good luck.
  230. ** Don't be a jerk to Alienslof or Rem [[hottip:*: Two of the most well-known GameMod makers, who focus on more [[{{Rule34}} adult mods]]]], being mean or trying to censor them will get you bombarded by people who think you're a zealous MoralGuardian who can't see the beauty of the human body, doesn't help that Slof is one of the only known female modders with noteriety.
  231. ** Mentioning anything about [[DiscreditedMeme arrows and knees]] pretty much anywhere will get you burned at the stake.
  232. * Go to any ''LegacyOfKain'' forums and declare that ''Blood Omen II'' absolutely deserves to be part of the game canon.
  233. ** Or better yet, ask why the pre-evolved vampires all wear tight leather pants with noticeable bulges. If you're lucky, you'll just get IP-banned from the forum.
  234. * Go to any ''VideoGame/{{Castlevania}}'' forum, and ask why the gamers hate [[PolygonCeiling 3D games]]. Or better yet, ask which game is worse: ''Curse of Darkness'' or ''Lament of Innocence''.
  235. ** Or how about this phrase: "I love the new anime art they chose for ''Dawn of Sorrow'' and ''Portrait of Ruin!''"
  236. ** Wiki/{{Uncyclopedia}} astutely notes that the easiest way to troll a ''Castlevania'' forum is to argue that ''Castlevania Legends'' should be canon and IGA [[RetCon retconned]] Sonia Belmont because he's sexist.
  237. ** Mention that you like the way Obata redesigned the character for ''CastlevaniaJudgment'' and you'll immediately be torn apart as a Manga/DeathNote fanboy by people who consider themselves true fans (unless you bring up Cornell, who they generally agree got a kickass redesign).
  238. * Discussing the pairings in the ''VideoGame/TalesOfSymphonia'' fandom (especially Lloyd/Colette, Lloyd/Sheena and Zelos/Sheena) runs the risk of initiating a flame war. If you must discuss the pairings, do ''not'' bring up the Drama [=CDs=] and whether they're canon or not. If you do, you only have yourself to blame.
  239. ** Or bash Colette. Seriously, this is a far greater source of flames than any of the ShipToShipCombat situations.
  240. ** Hell, how about [[VideoGame/TalesOfSymphoniaDawnoftheNewWorld the sequel]] [[ContestedSequel in general]]?
  241. * Go to ''TombRaider'' Forums and say that either Core Design or Crystal Dynamics suck. Watch the fur fly.
  242. ** ''Tomb Raider: Legend'' and ''Tomb Raider: Angel of Darkness'' have divided the fanbase. There are ''Legend'' fans who hate ''Angel of Darkness'' and vice-versa. The ''Angel of Darkness'' fans tend to be more bitter and outspoken towards ''Legend'' because Legend was developed by new developers Crystal Dynamics, and "Only Core fully understands Tomb Raider!" because "They made the classics!", casually forgetting that Core's interpretation of the ''Tomb Raider'' series changed radically over the six games they developed, and that ''Legend'' is much closer to the style of the original game than ''Angel of Darkness'' ever hoped to be.
  243. * Enjoy pain? Just go to any ''Zelda'' forum and bring up [[{{Bifauxnen}} Sheik's physical sex]]. Hope you already wrote your will. Hell, do it just about anywhere!
  244. ** If you want to get ''Legend Of Zelda'' fans riled up, talk about whether or not you think voice acting should be introduced to the series; this is one of the most controversial topics among Zelda fans. And if you ''really'' want to get them riled up, talk about whether or not you think ''Link himself'' should talk.
  245. ** Apparently, [[LegacyCharacter multiple Links]] running around is fine with Nintendo fans, but a simple [[ParentalAbandonment parentage affair]] hurts their minds.
  246. ** If you do bring up voice acting discussions on a forum or blog, watch the amount of people who respond to you by quoting or showing you {{Youtube Poop}}s of TheLegendOfZeldaCDiGames. Because a billion-dollar company doesn't learn from its 15-year old mistakes and can't just hire a professional, unionized voice acting studio for its projects.
  247. ** An efficient way to get flamed is to mention that ''[[VideoGame/TheLegendOfZeldaTheWindWaker Wind Waker]]'' was anything but a childish insult to hardcore gamers. If you have fireproof clothing handy, you might even claim it (or ''VideoGame/TheLegendOfZeldaMajorasMask'') was better than ''VideoGame/TheLegendOfZeldaOcarinaOfTime'', or criticise ''Ocarina of Time''.
  248. ** Now that a dedicated timeline has been released, the war has shifted over what the timeline could be to if the Canon is better than the {{Fanon}}. Especially since the new, third timeline is based in a world where the hero of time failed to stop Ganon.
  249. * Despite not being popular in the ''SuperMarioBros'' universe, if you're bored enough, go to any Mario related forum and talk about how [[SamusIsAGirl Birdo is really female]] or [[ShesAManInJapan is totally male]]. Expect to see responses that include "translation errors" or [[AllThereInTheManual "Birdo was always male because the manual said so."]]
  250. ** The same goes with Vivian. No doubt why Nintendo cut the "she is really a he" joke in the English versions.
  251. ** Speaking of Mario, try mentioning you like/dislike Princess Peach. Or, that you're indifferent towards her. You will be flamed.
  252. ** Try mentioning you don't like Yoshi. You will ''not'' get very far.
  253. * ''GuildWars'', go on one of the major forums and make a thread ranting about how high end [=PvPers=] are elitists for refusing to help newer players and how people in Heroes Ascent are killing their game type by refusing to let low ranked people play with them. You are in for a world of hurt.
  254. ** Alternately, say something positive about the assasins and especially the skill Shadow Form.
  255. * The ''MassEffect'' fandom:
  256. ** If you want to get them riled up, mention that BioWare must be homophobic since they didn't include any gay/lesbian love interests in the second game and, along similar veins, point out that their classification of asari as a mono gendered race instead of an AlwaysFemale one proves your point. Related to this topic, imply that everyone who disliked Mass Effect 3 did so because they are homophobic and hated the inclusion of the same-sex romances.
  257. ** Casually ask a group of fans this: ''Who do you prefer overall, Male or Female Shepard?'' Take it one step further and then ask ''Default Male Shepard or Custom Male Shepards''? Hope your shields are optimized.
  258. ** Surprisingly, when ''VideoGame/MassEffect2'' was announced for the PS3, the biggest issue seemed to be that ''VideoGame/MassEffect1'' was not being ported, so PS3 users were missing the full experience.
  259. ** Ask why the PS3 is getting free DLC. We dare you
  260. ** Casually mention that you play as a renegade or a paragon. Within minutes you'll get multiple people referring to you and/or your character as "stupid" or "naive" (if paragon) or "sociopathic", "evil", or "deserving of a bullet in the back by squadmates" (if renegade).
  261. *** Similarly, mention what class you play as. Soldiers get decried as 'boring GearsOfWar nuts', Adepts, Sentinels, and Engineers are 'underpowered and weak', Vanguards are 'flashy, cheap, overrated, and annoying', and Infiltrators 'can't do anything but hide'.
  262. ** Bring up ''Literature/MassEffectDeception''.
  263. ** Ask about the day one DLC, From Ashes.
  264. ** Go and pretend you are a random nobody on the Normandy in CerberusDailyNews; oh boy, you wil be shot on sight.
  265. ** The biggest case of backdraft in the history of this franchise is certainly the one regarding the ending of Mass Effect 3. Say ''anything'' about that ending that isn't distilled disgust. For best results, say it's a good ending and that Bioware shouldn't release some kind of DLC overriding it. Imply that those who don't like it [[TrueArtIsIncomprehensible simply don't understand it]].
  266. *** There's been a certain amount of backdraft against all the arguments about the endings as well. In particular, many people have gotten just plain sick of hearing about it and want to move on to other topics. There was also a case where some people who'd donated to the Child's Play charity said they wanted to withdraw their donations after learning the charity itself had no ties with the goal of Retake Mass Effect, which got a lot of people angry (including people from said movement), out of concern that they were using said charity to promote a cause other than helping sick kids.
  267. * Bring up ''TabletopGame/{{Warhammer}}'' in a ''VideoGame/{{Warcraft}}'' forum or vice versa, note the similarities, and enjoy the fireworks. In an attempt to prevent fires, many WAR posters started calling ''VideoGame/WorldOfWarcraft'' "that other game", [[TheScottishTrope The Game That Shall Not Be Named]] (TGTSNBN).
  268. ** In a similar but even more flammable way, mention ''Warhammer40000'' in a ''StarCraft'' forum, and without any further action on your part, it will inevitably devolve into a massive flame war between the two settings.
  269. * The fastest way to piss of the [[NipponIchi NIS]] fan base is by being a graphics whore.
  270. ** [[VideoGame/{{Disgaea 4| A Promise Unforgotten}} Artina]], oh Artina. A normal yet perhaps bland character in a sea of extremes, or a bitch PuritySue that everyone loves? You won't hear the end of it. And good luck if you ask about shipping her with Val.
  271. * Pick somewhere, anywhere, doesn't matter, just go to someplace on the internet and even suggest that [[StreetFighter Dan Hibiki]] is a JokeCharacter. You ''will'' have multiple Dan Devotees crawling out of the woodwork to explain to you how he's [[SeriousBusiness just as serious and valid as any other fighter]] and you had better show some respect to the greatest street fighter '''''EVAR'''''.
  272. ** Mention you're fine that he [[ShooOutTheClowns was killed off]] in ''VideoGame/StreetFighterXTekken'' and you'll get roasted.
  273. * Due to the causes of its delay, discussions about Islam around ''anything'' related to ''[[LittleBigPlanet [=LittleBigPlanet=]]]''.
  274. ** Or worse, the user-created content intellectual property and/or moderation debacles. Especialy ludicrous with the latter, since Sony does remove levels based on other intellectual property, ''even those that they own''.
  275. * Suggest a change to ''EveOnline'' that would make piracy more difficult or borrow from other [=MMO=]s.
  276. ** Suggest changes to ''EveOnline'' that would make Suicide Ganking more difficult. Or that changes the way aggression from salvaging someone else's wreck works. Or that would change the aggression mechanics for Remote Repair modules.
  277. * Go on the GameFAQs board of ''VideoGame/StreetFighterIV'' and suggest that the game may be actually pretty decent and that Capcom isn't conspiring to kill the franchise. You're in for a '''whole world of pain.''' Though, considering what the [=GameFAQs=] boards are like, that's no surprise.
  278. ** In regards to StreetFighter as a whole... Mention the word {{Shotoclone}}. You'll witness a bloody war within the next five minutes.
  279. * If you value your life, do NOT say anything positive about ''Wii Music''. Apparently, '''nobody''' is allowed to even ''remotely'' enjoy the game, since doing so will cause Nintendo to make more {{casual game}}s, thus games are totally ruined!
  280. * Go into a messageboard or blog comment thread based around a ''Gran Turismo'' game and bring up ''Forza Motorsport'', or vice-versa. Or bring up how much more fun arcade racers like ''{{Burnout}}'' are. ''Or'' mention that you've been playing super-technical PC racing sims like ''GTR'' and ''Live For Speed'' for years and know for a ''fact'' that they are more true-to-life than any dumbed-down, arcadey console ?sim? racer.
  281. * Kanji's sexual preference in ''{{Persona 4}}'' is up to the interpretation of the players. As a result, you have people arguing that he is, without a doubt, 100% straight/gay/bi. This situation is made worse when {{Shipping}} enters into the equation, since Kanji's sexuality would naturally determine whether he can be with Naoto or not. Of course, Naoto [[spoiler:is a potential love interest for the main character, so ShipToShipCombat will ALSO get involved]].
  282. ** On that note, never ever bring up [[spoiler:Naoto in a schoolgirl uniform]] unless you want to spend the next few hours of your life arguing fiercely about heteronormative gender roles, feminism, or pointless fanservice. And ''God help you'' if you voice your approval for it. Not to mention, this WILL bring up the question of the year: "[[spoiler: Is Naoto a mere WholesomeCrossdresser, or a straight-up female-to-male TransSexual?]]", which is ANOTHER can of worms.
  283. *** This has been re-sparked by the a recent novel. [[spoiler: Where Naoto decides to try a GirlinessUpgrade, donning skirts and longer hair]]. Don't mention it... it's for your own good.
  284. ** In fact, just mention ''{{Persona 3}}'' or ''Persona 4'' around people who [[NostalgiaFilter liked the first (or second) one better]], and tend to have a really snotty attitude towards people who entered the series at P3 or P4.
  285. ** Two freaking days after a Famitsu scan of the ''{{Persona 3}}'' ''Portable'' release, and the forums are starting to heat up. ''Damn''.
  286. ** Do ''not'' bring up any of the female main character's romantic social links, or the lack thereof.
  287. ** Go to any SMT forums, and call ''{{Persona 3}}'' and ''{{Persona 4}}'' "Glorified {{Dating Sim}}s", and duck!
  288. ** Or say you prefer Yuzu's Ending in ''VideoGame/DevilSurvivor'' (for anything besides its [[SequelHook Sequel possibility]]), and pray that you won't be incinerated.
  289. ** Tell a ''Persona 3'' fan you liked ''Persona 4'', and watch as you get flamed.
  290. * Saying something bad about [[NintendoHard EV training]] or [[StopHavingFunGuys IV Breeding]], saying you competitively battle {{Pokemon}} you don't do these with, or even ''admitting'' you don't EV train can make you hated by some hardcore competitive Pokémon fans.
  291. ** Three words: Random number generator.
  292. ** Which [[FanNickname Eeveelution (IE: The numerous evolutions of Eevee)]] is the best? Don't ask. You'll never get an answer that doesn't result in a billion flames in response.
  293. *** At least it's practically 100% agreed that Flareon is the worst, as far as gameplay goes.
  294. *** Speaking of the Eeveelutions, try to mention that you find them overrated. If you're lucky, you'll be able to make it out with only a few minor burns from the ensuing flame war.
  295. ** Asking whether or not (insert Pokémon here) is overrated will cause flaming as well. Examples include Mewtwo, Charizard, Dragonite, Pikachu, and Blastoise, among others.
  296. ** Never casually ask whether fans think the classic games (Generations I and II) are better than the new games (Generations III, IV, and V). One side is surely bound to get heavy flames from the other and vice versa.
  297. *** With the games which have been remade, whether the originals or the remakes are canon is contested by fans of the newer games and fans of the older games. The latter group is further divided into people who are happy to regard the remakes as canon (because that divorces Generations I and II from the later games), and those who aren't (because it means acknowledging that the originals aren't officially canon).
  298. ** On the subject of Legendaries, go and claim that Suicune, Entei, and Raikou are dogs/cats. Enjoy the heat!
  299. *** Better yet, contest that they're [[{{LetsPlay/Chuggaaconroy}} gerbils]]. HilarityEnsues.
  300. ** Arceus is getting a lot of this lately. Either its the ultimate legendary Pokémon (IE: [[FanNickname Pokégod]]), is just another legendary (albeit a very powerful one), or simply some gimmick that Game Freak thought up for yet another random event. Fans will never fully agree on either one.
  301. ** If you don't know how to RNG abuse, then you are a noob who doesn't deserve to know.
  302. ** Mew's gender. Good Arceus, Mew's gender! Officially, Mew is an "it" (it doesn't have a gender at all). That hasn't stopped many-a-flame-war of people saying "Mew's a girl! She's pink and she gave birth to Mewtwo!". Heck, just genders of ''any'' Legendary Pokémon for that matter... especially since '''most''' of them oficially don't have a gender at all.
  303. ** May Arceus have mercy on the poor soul who goes onto any Pokémon forum and asks "Is Rotom a Legendary?". Officially, it's not, but that hasn't stopped MANY a flame-war due to the fact that the music that plays when you encounter it is the same as when you encounter an actual Legendary.
  304. *** It doesn't really help considering it's a one-of-kind Pokémon that you can only get ''after'' defeating the Elite Four.
  305. **** You can get it before the Elite Four in Platinum.
  306. ** TwoWords: Hacked Pokémon. Is it [[NoFairCheating reprehensible]], or a perfectly legitimate [[strike:(albeit unconventional)]] way to get perfect Pokémon?
  307. *** Actually, asking whether things like Game Shark,Pokesav or Action Replay (the, or one of the,main methods of acquiring hacked Pokemon as well as health and item cheats ect)are good or bad in general will cause a war to break out. It's either a nice way to get better mons and event mons you otherwise can't get after a certain amount of time has passed or terrible and sure to break your game. (Some AR codes will cause crashes or the notorious 'bad eggs',so you do need to be careful.)
  308. ** Call Red 'Ash'. There has been blood spilled at GameFAQs over this.
  309. *** Even worse, try to say Red and Ash are one character or that Red is [[CriticalResearchFailure based off]] Ash. Also, implying Leaf or Silver are named anything other than "Leaf" or "Silver" can cause blood to spill. Occasionally calling Ethan "Gold" will garner a heavy backdraft.
  310. ** Just casually mention Zoroark. Chances are, you'll be bombarded with flames stating "It's a rip-off of Lucario!"
  311. ** Mewtwo's relationship with Mew. Just. Mewtwo's relationship with Mew. Did Mew give birth like the game says? Is Mewtwo just an artificial clone of Mew? No two fans will fully agree on which is canon.
  312. ** Team Rocket VS Team Magma/Aqua VS Team Galactic VS Team Plasma. On second thought, don't ask. In some cases, you can safely compare any of them to Cipher, but it may be better to not take a chance.
  313. ** Contests. Dear sweet Arceus, the Contests! Do they add more variety into the games, or are they just a pointless gimmick to distract the player from the main goal?
  314. ** Go on any big Pokémon forum with a large amount of UK users and mention either 'Gazooki', 'Kinneas', 'VGC 2010', or '512 [=EVs=] on Giratina'. Sit back and watch as people argue whether Kinneas was robbed or he deserved it for getting someone else to hack for him (strangely enough, the culprit seems to get awaym with it for the most part).
  315. *** This is why you should always check for 512s via CHECKING THEIR STATS. If the stats are legal, check the Hidden Power type.
  316. ** Leaf and Lyra break the base quite easily. 'Does Leaf exist in canon? Who is better, Kris or Lyra? Is Lyra a redesign of Kris; are they the same person?' Don't ask any of these, even on the most calm of boards all hell will break loose.
  317. ** Reshiram and Zekrom, the mascots for Black/White. It's nearly impossible to simply ''mention'' them without getting flame wars of "OMG! Reshiram/Zekrom is awesome!" VS "They look like rip-offs of Digimon!".
  318. *** Zekrom itself especially seems to fall victim to this. Some fans love its appearance, while others immediately cry out "Its a rip-off of Palkia!". It's best to just not ask fans what they think of it.
  319. ** Ubers. Just casually mentioning them is enough to warrent a major flame-war among the fandom.
  320. ** Just try to get into a Stealth Rock debate on a forum populated by competitive battlers.
  321. ** For some nuclear-grade heat, just go onto some Pokemon-related board and mention Website/{{Smogon}}. Sit back and enjoy the show.
  322. ** Even how to simply ''pronounce'' the names of Pokémon can cause a good sized flame war. Is it "Ar-cuh-nine" or "Are-cay-nine"? Is it "Pid-gee-ot", "Pid-jot", or "Pid-jit"? Is it "Ar-say-us", "Ar-see-us", or "Ar-kee-us"? No two fans will ever fully agree.
  323. *** Speaking of names, never mention that you think the Japanese names are better than the English ones. EVER.
  324. ** Who you believe is the canon protagonist is a big problem in the fanbase. Lately, timelines are becoming an issue too. Go onto any Pokemon forum and say the Johto games came after the Sinnoh games, or that the Hoenn games and Kanto games aren't happening at the same time.
  325. ** The overhaul of the battle system in Generation IV which meant a move's status as 'physical' or 'special' wasn't necessarily dictated by type. Many of those who prefer the old system believe the new one dumbed down the game by making it too easy to counter weaknesses, and that people who prefer it either lack the ability to make trade-offs or are too attracted to flashy presentation to make a fair decision. Many who prefer the new system think the old one restricted the player's choices when building a team, and that people who prefer that system either can't strategise for themselves or can't appreciate that the new system is more logical. ''Both'' level at each other the accusation that the other system is less strategic.
  326. *** It would be complicated to explain how the changing mechanics of the games have altered the popularity of Gyarados, but let's just say that the further back the generation in which you believe he debuted as a useable character, the more likely any expression of that view is to start an argument over his usefulness in various games.
  327. ** [[FunWithAcronyms F.E.A.R. (Focus Sash, Endeavor, Quick Attack, Rattata)]]. Is it a legitimate strategy to face off against tough opponents, or just a cheap gimmick to win a battle using an otherwise ''very'' weak Pokemon?
  328. *** Likewise, saying you managed to beat a team of Ubers using far weaker Pokemon will either cause people to congratulate you, or point out in annoyance how you're bragging over something a "noob" learns how to do pretty early on.
  329. ** Ever since it was first revealed, ''[[VideoGame/PokemonBlack2AndWhite2 Black 2 and White 2]]'' have fallen under this. Fans are arguing whether or not a direct sequel to a previous game is a "fresh new turn" for the franchise or a "bad sequel to a good/bad game".
  330. *** Go ahead and imply that the announcement of ''Black 2'' and ''White 2'' means that there won't be any remakes of ''Ruby'' or ''Sapphire''. You'll be lucky if you make it out with only a minor flame war.
  331. *** Kyurem's two new forms. Are they gimmicky, plot-relevant, ugly, awesome? No two people will agree.
  332. ** Just mentioning the '''looks''' of Pokemon will cause an inferno of flame wars. Are the newer Pokemon uglier than the older ones? Are the older designs duller? Do the newer Pokemon look too cartoony? Do the older Pokemon look too animalistic? Or vice versa?
  333. *** For added bonus, say you like/dislike the looks of certain Pokemon. Bonus flame points for mentioning you like Jynx's appearance (both new and old).
  334. *** Speaking of Jynx's appearance, say you like her older design better and claim it wasn't racist. Be prepared to have '''tons''' of "evidence" from both sides of the argument dumped onto you.
  335. ** Try asking if Pokemon promotes "animal abuse" or if it encourages "dog fighting" and/or "cockfighting" (Ahem, we mean with roosters). If you're lucky, you'll manage to get away with a simple heated debate. If not, you'll be roasted by flames.
  336. *** The fifth gen games actually use this concept as one of the main conflicts in the game. Fans tend to widely disagree with whether or not N was in the right.
  337. * Go to the ''VideoGame/EarthBound'' forum. Find one of the threads where people have posted negative reviews of the game from GameFAQs. Next, suggest that ''Earthbound'' might not be for everyone. You may want to wear body armor for this one.
  338. ** Or mention that the black space in the third part of the Giygas battle looks like a fetus. One site even temporarily banned the word "fetus" from its Earthbound forum because the mods were sick of cleaning up the flamewars.
  339. ** Just say you like other [=RPGs=] more than any of the MOTHER games, they will probably call you a retarded Final Fantasy fanboy.
  340. * Here's a fun one for all you ''{{Touhou}}'' fans: First, create a hack for the original games that completely changes the playing experience (newer graphics, invincibility cheats, what have you.) Now, post it to the fan community. The blood that will be shed soon afterwards will be enough to keep [[OurVampiresAreDifferent Remilia]] happy for ''decades.''
  341. ** Or, say that you want to buy the physical copies of the games instead of torrenting them. Or, mention that you use any kind of input besides a keyboard to play.
  342. ** The biggest backdraft comes from outside the fanbase, not from the inside. Go tell some forum that you like Touhou and see what happens. Better yet, do a crossover between Touhou and a manly American thing like Halo or God of War and hear them scream.
  343. ** "What anime is this?"
  344. *** "NO YOU STUPID HORRIBLE INSUFFERABLE IDIOT, IT'S A VIDEO GAME SERIES."
  345. ** Say that you dislike ''Touhou'' because it's {{Moe}}, has lolis, or is a CuteEmUp. Fans will proceed to dismantle your claims [[GrammarNazi because of your word choice]].
  346. ** Any mention of the [[MemeticMutation McRoll's.]] Especially if it's remotely positive.
  347. * There are several buzzwords that will start a fight on a GunZTheDuel-driven board, but God help you if you say an automatic-fire weapon is a good weapon. If you do bring it up, not even an invulnerability to flames will save you, because the flame war that will spark will be fought with hydrochloric acid vats. At the very least, you ''will'' be called a "sprayer" and a {{noob}}, even if you conserve ammo and hit with most of your shots.
  348. ** One should never mention that they find knife-gimping a cheap tactic that ruins the fun of the game. Knife-gimping is when a player uses the dagger's alternate attack which knocks the opponent down, then rapidly switches to a powerful gun (usually an automatic) for easy headshots. This is pretty much a guaranteed kill even when on full health.
  349. ** K-style: Is it glitching (and therefore cheating) or a legitimate style? And is it superior to using guns?
  350. * The ''KnightsOfTheOldRepublic'' fandom has evolved over the years into a partially BrokenBase. Go somewhere where a lot of the fans hang out and bring up whether or not the first game or the second game is better.
  351. ** Another fast way to start a big kaboom in that fandom is to ask what Revan or Exile's alignment or gender were. Cue massive FanonDisContinuity on both fronts.
  352. ** Granted, these are mostly vocal minorities as the majority of fans seem to like both just fine. But the minorities are ''very'' [[VocalMinority vocal.]]
  353. ** The announced MMO by BioWare [[ItGotWorse made it worse]]. Whether you like it or hate it, it's a guarentee a flame war will erupt if it is invoked.
  354. * Need a source of ignition fast? Go to the ''VideoGame/CommandAndConquer'' forums, and say any unit is over/underpowered. For increased damage, suggest balance changes.
  355. ** Even better. Claim you like where EA has taken the franchise. Praise C + C Generals for being an excellent addition. You can also claim EA is an evil empire that runs on the tortured souls of former Westwood employees and have the same effect.
  356. *** It is Command & Conquer, not Command + Conquer, hence the correct abbreviation is either C&C or the phonetic abbreviation CnC! Likewise it is TiberiAN Sun, not TiberiUM Sun and may Kane have mercy on your heathenly soul if you ever write NOD instead of Nod. And if you're in for some Blackhand Tortilla Party-level roasting, just mention the latest game: "Command & Conquer 4 - Tiberian Twilight"... to quote the Blackhand: "Let the flames rise."
  357. * It's too obvious if you walk into a forum for VideoGame/{{Prototype}} or ''VideoGame/InFAMOUS'' and [[DuelingGames mention the other]]. Instead, try to suggest that both are good and deserve to be played for being good instead of how they measure up to the other. And then run like hell.
  358. ** Some context helps with this one: both games are [[WideOpenSandbox sandboxes]] where the protagonist is a man with recently inhereted superpowers in an otherwise normal world, running around a huge urban setting. The similarities end there, but their release dates being two weeks apart has sealed both games in a neverending loop of Epic Rage from fans of one who would rather talk about how much better the game they like is, instead of admitting that entire genres can have more than one decent product. Popular arguments repeated ''ad nausea'' include which protagonist is stronger, which setting is better, whether or not ''VideoGame/InFAMOUS'' being a [=PS3=] exclusive "obviously" makes it better or worse, and which storyline is more interesting. These arguments started ''before VideoGame/{{Prototype}} was released.''
  359. * Once Valve announced a sequel to ''Left4Dead'', the fan base had divided and exploded in a fury because A) the sequel is coming one year after the release of the first game and B) has content that people say should have been in the first game. Many have called Valve a sell out and the more extreme people have formed a Steam group to gather all the displeased fans and call for a boycott (so far having over 30,000 members). If you want to see the fan base get pissed off, just tell them to suck it up, don't buy the game, or say you support a sequel. Expect replies like "not a true fan" or having someone claiming you're just a console gaming {{scrub}}.
  360. ** To rub more salt in the wound, Valve claimed that the boycott has not worked since they gotten more pre-orders for the sequel than they did for the first game. Mentioning this to the boycotters is a surefire way to provoke angry fanboy rage.
  361. ** With the announcent of a survivor sacrifcing their life for the team in the DLC for Left 4 Dead 1, now people are quite upset at Valve for "destryoing any continuity" the game might have had in future [=DLCs=].
  362. ** Go to the steam forums and state that the PC version of Left 4 Dead 2 is a console port.
  363. ** You are bound to provoke fanboy rage if you bring up the following:
  364. *** VS mode is balanced and doesn't need tweaking.
  365. *** The animations for survivors/infected are fine and don't need changing.
  366. *** Mention how there doesn't need to be a system for matchmaking/punishing rage quitters/etc.
  367. *** Ask if ''Left 4 Dead 2'' is better than ''Left 4 Dead''.
  368. *** Ask which group of survivors are the best ones.
  369. *** Ask whether or not the daylight settings are better than the nighttime settings.
  370. *** Ask whether or not the game could use hats like ''VideoGame/TeamFortress2'' did or if having an in-game store like Team Fortress 2 could help bring in more players for Left 4 Dead 2.
  371. *** State that the Jockey can be useful when playing as him in VS.
  372. *** Ask everyone if they think melee weapons make the game too easy or if the guns are too overpowered against the infected in VS.
  373. ** Heck, mention ''anything'' on the steam forums for Left 4 Dead. The base there is so broken on everything that you could mention CHEESE and get a flame war on what type of cheese is best.
  374. * ''VideoGame/ChronoCross'' and its status as a sequel to ''VideoGame/ChronoTrigger''. There are sites that will calmly discuss many of the above points and yet get into violent disagreement over the issue.
  375. ** It's also not a good idea to ask whether or not Square Enix was right to issue a cease-and-desist order to the FanSequel ''FanFic/CrimsonEchoes'', or whether or not the creators of the game were right to comply with the cease-and-desist order itself. You'll get [[FlameWar passionate]] arguments from both sides of these debates.
  376. ** For bonus points, try saying that the cease and desist wasn't even real and that the creators simply didn't feel like finishing it and wanted to go out in a burst of martyrdom. You'll get roasted to death within ''seconds''.
  377. * If you really want to watch the fireworks, go to a [[SpyroTheDragon Spyro Forum]], and start talking about how wonderful {{Sierra}}'s reboot of the series is and talk about [[FreudWasRight how sexy Cynder is]]. In no time will you have the "classics" fans vs. "legends" fans wars going on.
  378. ** For extra flames, say anything ''remotely'' positive about ''SkylandersSpyrosAdventure''.
  379. ** For even more sparks, say that {{Sierra}} has better soundtracks than the stuff of the classics by Stweart Copeland; you're bound to have a few nasty words being tossed back and forth. Of course, if you really have the nerves, ask if they [[ComplainingAboutShowsYouDontWatch actually even listened to both soundtracks]].
  380. * Say that your favorite ''Ace Attorney'' soundtrack is not the first game's. Go on!
  381. ** Say you liked Apollo (or his game) better.
  382. ** Ask who the most evil villain of the series is. You might get agreement within each game - despite the "[[spoiler: Zak]] is a jerk" movement, there's not that much debate on who the main villain of AJAA is - and you might even get a plurality to say that Redd White is the worst villain who wasn't directly involved in the final case of any game (provided 1-4 and 1-5 are both considered final) - but asking who the worst villain is in the series overall can raise some disputes.
  383. ** Who should Phoenix be shipped with? [[FoeYay Edgeworth]]? Maya? [[spoiler: Iris]]? Franzy? Someone else? Try saying that he's a better partner for Mia than Diego to get Diego/Mia shippers in on the action.
  384. *** For that matter, merely asking about Edgeworth's orientation or whether Phoenix is bisexual can get some disputes going.
  385. ** In relation to Trials and Tribulations: ask what [[spoiler: Diego's punishment should be]] to see some backdraft.
  386. ** For backdraft or [[BaseBreaker base breaking]], say that you feel sorry for any murderer (besides maybe the two sympathetic ones from Justice For All). Say that you feel sorry for [[spoiler: Dahlia Hawthorne]] from Trials and Tribulations.
  387. * Is [[VideoGame/TalesOfVesperia Yuri]] a hypocrite? Were [[spoiler:his murders of Ragou and Cumore]] justified? Is Estelle's desire to see the world a good thing or just selfish? Is the 360 version an ObviousBeta? Ask at your own peril.
  388. * Find a ''[[TalesSeries Tales]]'' community where a sufficient amount of people have played both the original and the remake of ''VideoGame/TalesOfDestiny.'' Then discuss Rutee's worth as a character. For added blazing, discuss the merits of her relationship with Stahn, especially compared to Stahn's relationships with Philia and Leon. Dymlos couldn't have created hotter flames if he tried.
  389. ** Who was the red-haired man at the end of ''VideoGame/TalesOfTheAbyss''? If you value your life, don't ask.
  390. ** For that matter, debating between Asch and Luke in general can generate some massive heat.
  391. ** Go to any ''VideoGame/TalesOfTheAbyss'' forum and ask if Luke was responsible for what happened at Akzeriuth or not. A 20-page flame war is practically guaranteed to ensue.
  392. ** Similar case with [[BigBad Van's]] plan to re-create the world to escape the Score. [[WellIntentionedExtremist A good idea to free humanity from the future]] or the rantings of a guy who takes religion way too seriously?
  393. * Want to know how to send a ResidentEvil board into a frenzy? Just start a debate as to whether or not the heavier focus on action in ''4'' and ''5'' is a good thing.
  394. ** Try claiming ''ResidentEvil5'' is racist.
  395. *** Or try claiming that it ''isn't'' racist. Either way, you won't come out on top.
  396. ** Want a mass of fans on the forums to dogpile you? Mention you really enjoyed the movie adaptations and liked Alice as a character.
  397. ** Or that ''Survivor'' and ''Dead Aim'' are misunderstood entries that deserve to be undeniably canon and their characters brought back in new installments.
  398. ** Just try to say you don't like Wesker. The fandom will swarm all over you the second you click the "post" button.
  399. * The ''DragonAge'' fandom has Mages vs. Templars as the main source of non-shipping related neverending forum wank, especially since ''DragonAgeII'' kicked the conflict off in earnest in story, which each faction having its rabid supporters ready to flame the opposing side to ashes at the slightest provocation. Though even this fight can usually expect ShipToShipCombat to turn up at some point between Fenris and Anders fans (since each character represents the extremes of each viewpoint). And if you really want an inferno, ask whether or not [[spoiler:Anders]] was justified in his actions at the end of the second game. Yikes.
  400. ** Start a discussion about whether Loghain was a psychopath bent on destroying the Wardens and his country or a hero who, because of his deep care for his country and his family, ''maybe'' overstepped the boundaries a bit.
  401. ** Dragon Age II itself is quite a backdraft magnet, usually in the form of a Greek chorus decrying it as "dumbed down".
  402. *** And don't mention the Elves' design in [=DA2=]. Ever.
  403. * A great way to simulate the '''Conflict''' extrinsic in the ''{{Nethack}}'' forums is to start discussion on "Numeric pad versus HJKL" or something to that effect. Better make sure your AC is high enough and your resistances sufficient to handle the resulting uproar.
  404. * Go to a ''Wangan Midnight Maximum Tune'' forum and ask whether or not [[CosmeticAward dress-up parts]] affect a car's performance. If you're being asked instead, refer to the [[AllThereInTheManual manual's]] take on dress-up parts (it says they have no effect).
  405. * Now ''DissidiaFinalFantasy'' is trapped in the same "fighting game/not a fighting game" debate as ''VideoGame/SuperSmashBros.'' above... only its case has been amplified far more than it should have been due to the American version being released concurrently with ''[[SoulSeries Soulcalibur: Broken Destiny]]'', a traditional PSP fighter.
  406. * Players in ''VideoGame/TeamFortress2'' have seen hats at random which are so rare that people want to [[GottaCatchEmAll catch them all]]. This has lead to some people to use idler programs (a program to emulate playing ''VideoGame/TeamFortress2'' by sending the required data to the Steam client) to catch the hats without having to play the game. Valve responded to this by taking away some items from the cheaters and gave the legit hat grabbers a halo to wear. FridgeLogic to the extreme, the cheaters are pissed off about the halo thing and ''have flamed the players that obtained the halos''. That's right, playing fair is somehow not the way to play. Some people have even gone as far as making mods where the halos are replaced by the word FAG. A surefire FlameWar will brew up if you even talk about the halo.
  407. ** This has to be added before something ''[[FlameWar worse]]'' comes up and a flamey reply could come around. From the idlers' point of view it went more like this: "What? They're taking away all our items and calling us cheaters? There was no mention that this kind of thing was against the rules, (note that it WAS in the steam TOU that programs "emulating Steam's services" were not allowed) why are we being punished instead of getting a warning? And the people who didn't use the idle program are getting hats for not knowing about the idler program? (Yes, indeed, some idle progammers did seem to think that EVERYONE would use it if given a choice) This is bull!" Of course, in the end, people on BOTH sides overreacted, and BOTH sides were seen as the overreactors (mainly because, of course, the people who overreact are the [[{{Troll}} most vocal]]). The paragraph above describes what the average non-idler saw ("We didn't cheat, we get rewarded, you guys are mad for getting punished for cheating). What the overreacting idlers saw was "Look at these little white-knighters thinking they're morally superior (which is the wording Valve actually used)! What a bunch of brats! I'm going to make a custom model for the haloes saying "fag" teehee". Both sides had their problem people.
  408. ** Really, though, considering that hats have no ingame value [[NiceHat other than looking cool]], some people may have been annoyed by the fact that they were being called cheaters for exploiting a system which many found broken for an item that did nothing.
  409. ** Also, what is Pyro's gender? No one knows, but people will argue both ways.
  410. *** Even Valve themselves.
  411. ** Go ahead and imply that the store (and the Mann-conomy Update as a whole) was a good idea. The Flamethrower has never gotten so much use (especially after the nerfs - another hotbed).
  412. ** Say you don't think the game is that great, or that another multiplayer experience is more fun. The general response will be something along the lines of 'STFU console monkey, stop sucking'
  413. ** Now, with the fact that the game has become FreeToPlay, the community has erupted in a fireball large enough to see from space! It could be divided into many parts, but the biggest is this: People who think they deserve a refund for a game they payed for years ago, and those who answer with "the movie you payed to watch years ago is now free on TV, are you going to throw a hissy fit?"
  414. ** Go to anywhere competitive-based and bring up the Quick-Fix, Black Box, or that you think Heavies require skill. And, of course, game balance.
  415. ** The Grordbort/retro-future items, mainly the weapons. Are they interesting and cool-looking with unique features, or overly-detailed trash that conflict with the art style and are [[ScrappyWeapon stupid]] or [[GameBreaker overpowered]]? And among these, the [[KillItWithFire Phlogisitonator]] is the most controversial. Does it go back to the Pyro's roots of ambush tactics, or is it a horrendously-balanced [[LeeroyJenkins W+M1]] promoter that removes the Pyro's [[TennisBoss sole useful competitive trait]]?
  416. ** In fact, come to think of it, mention ''anything'' having to do with ''anything'' and there '''''will''''' be a flamewar.
  417. * ''MonkeyIsland2'' - was the GainaxEnding ''supposed'' to be the definitive end of the series that was trampled over by callous [[ExecutiveMeddling cold-hearted corporate overlords]]? This causes a lot of people to come to serious blows, and this pretty much flares up every time someone revives the series for any reason.
  418. ** The use of the Hint Board on the TelltaleGames site draws ire from the StopHavingFunGuys who had actually demanded for the Hint Board to be ''shut down''. Let's not even get into the Merfolks being "Too fantastic" for the voodoo-pirate and magical soft drinks pirate game.
  419. * So ''VideoGame/DanceDanceRevolution'' players, how about that safety bar?
  420. ** On that note, don't mention you think the home version is better then the arcade.
  421. * ''ModernWarfare 2'': Fans are split on on the level "No Russian", where the player [[spoiler:controls a "terrorist" who intentionally shoots civilians at an airport (it's a spoileriffic [[GambitIndex gambit]])]]. Supporters of the scenes herald them as artistic, while others are offended at the scenes, considering them "worse than GTA" and pleading for the scenes to be cut (they only got a compromise: The game asks you if you want to skip the level before starting it). It amped up when the MoralGuardians jumped on this specific backdraft, starting with FoxNews.
  422. ** The lack of mod support, Activision raising the retail price from $50 to $60, when PC games usually retail around the former price, deathstreak rewards, or the killstreak reward of a ''tactical nuke'' (which is essentially an "I win" button). You know what? It's easier to say the game itself is just Internet Backdraft material.
  423. * Go to any SpaceChannel5 fansite and say that you like Chief Blank.
  424. * Go to a discussion about ''MetalSlug'' and say that you like ''MetalSlug 4''. For bonus points, say that you like it better than at least one other game in the series.
  425. ** For even more bonus points, say it's better than Metal Slug 3.
  426. * Bring up a video of someone demonstrating ''VideoGame/{{Tetris}}: The Grand Master'' mastery. While you'll get some comments about how it looks very nice, you'll also draw purist trolls who claim that it's fake, on the basis that it's impossible to do on the Game Boy or NES versions. (Never mind that every version of Tetris plays differently to some extent, depending on who developed it.)
  427. * Do ''not'' talk about the Balkans on the ParadoxInteractive forums. There are as many views on how the Balkan cultures should be represented in CrusaderKings and the EuropaUniversalis games as there are posters from the Balkans, which is quite a few.
  428. * Go onto a StarCraft forum and ask for help deciding on what game to get, StarCraft 2 or the latest Command and Conquer. Mention better graphics and more units as merits for C&C.
  429. ** Not that Starcraft II by itself isn't enough reason to complain. Hot topics include, but aren't limited to:
  430. *** Daring to compare ''DragonAge: Origins'' to any RPG that doesn't start with [[BaldursGate "Baldur's"]] and end with [[BaldursGate "Gate"]] -- even games [=BioWare=] themselves have developed -- is considered grounds to be called a n00b that wouldn't know a good game if it bit him. Bonus points if you admit that you ''prefer'' some aspects of ''Dragon Age''.
  431. *** Also, just go to any fan-forum and argue that the DLC was cut from the game to make extra money and should be free.
  432. *** Also better to reserve your comments on how you feel about the word on the changes that were apparently made to ''DragonAgeII'' (welcome as an interesting change or polishing, or turning the series into "''MassEffect'' with swords"?). Trying to mention it in any positive manner will have the flamethrowers hitting full force against you courtesy of /v/ and RPG Codex
  433. * Yet another GameFaqs gem: go to the [[PunchOut Punch-Out!!]] boards, and offer an opinion on whether the boxer in the SNES Super Punch-Out!! is Little Mac, or not Mac. Or even that who he is doesn't matter. Flame on!
  434. * Say that you think that ''VideoGame/MegaManBattleNetwork 4'' was the best of the BN games. Hell, saying that you like any of the BN games around fans of the other series will get you killed.
  435. * Go to the AmericasArmy forum and ask for an [=MP5=]. Or a knife. You will be slain. [[CuteKitten (Along with a kitten. Think of the kittens!)]] The reason for this is that although [=MP5=]'s are used in the military, they aren't assigned as standard weapons for the units in the game. Most people who ''still'' ask for an [=MP5=] didn't bother to read the other fifty-billion threads where this was explicated.
  436. ** Asking about Desert Eagles merely warrants pity for the poor [[VideoGame/{{Counter-Strike}} CS child]].
  437. *** Same for any other tacti[[RuleOfCool cool]] gun (OICW, G36, [=XM8=], Intervention, TDI Vector, etc.), but this will escalate to slay + kitten if you try to argue it further. ''Especially'' if you mention your buddy in the ultra-mega-secret-Special Forces who can ''totally'' get Uncle Sam to buy him whatever weapons he wants.
  438. * Go anywhere and say that while everyone agrees that TheLegendOfZeldaCDIGames are horrible, they should still be considered part of Zelda canon.
  439. ** If you're really brave, tell everyone that you '''liked''' those games more than any other Zelda games, and be prepared to take cover.
  440. * Do ''not'' go to a ''WarhammerOnline'' forum and mention that with the hinting that Skaven will be added as a playable race in the future and that Lizardmen would be the sensible "Order" choice to oppose them in the game's "paired races" [=RvR=] system, unless you want to thread to devolve into a giant trainwreck of arguing back and forth on whether or not the Tabletop {{Canon}} supports this possibility, or ''absolutely any and everything else in the game''.
  441. * On the ElementalWarOfMagic forums, there have been 3-4 threads or so on whether magic damage should be split into multiple types (Earth, cold, lightning, etc.), or combined into a single type, including arguments as to whether the game would be completely broken if one of the choices was made (This is a game that also includes an economic system, lots of other combat options, unusual diplomacy, etc.). Starting the same argument again may not have the same result, but it may be a possibility.
  442. * [[VideoGame/ArmoredCore There is no game named "Nine Breaker." There isn't. Shut up.]]
  443. * So VisualNovel players, what do ya feel about developper Minori's supposed xenophobia and crusade against {{fan translation}}s and DigitalPiracyIsEvil since April 2010?
  444. * If {{Spore}}'s [[CopyProtection SecuROM]] isn't enough fire for you, you can try...
  445. ** Mention how cute and funny the overall look of the game is and how the cartoony nature doesn't really need a whole lot of science in order to be enjoyed on the casual level. Wait 5 minutes and [[StepThreeProfit PROFIT!]]
  446. ** Clark & Stanley adventures, full stop. May [[strike:God]] Spode have mercy on your soul.
  447. ** Point out that the Most Popular New Creations are not a bad thing and the Sporepedia isn't flawed and only subject to SturgeonsLaw like everything else.
  448. * The Western localization of {{Cave}} ports. Discussing them tends to illicit harassment from people who will tell you to shut the fuck up and get a Japanese Xbox360 instead.
  449. ** Mention the US localization of ''{{Deathsmiles}}'' around any group of {{Cave}} fans and the resulting vitrol will be enough to destroy all of Japan.
  450. ** Mentioning on certain forums that you think more {{shmup}}s should be region free or have Western releases is going to piss off some people, who will tell you to put up with the prices of Japanese-region consoles and arcade hardware because "this is an expensive hobby."
  451. * The ''VideoGame/{{X-COM}}'' FPS has sparked quite a bit of this, mainly due to TheyChangedItNowItSucks.
  452. * The arguments about which faction was best in ''{{Geneforge}}'' were quite fun to watch, because they generally weren't about things like "coolness," instead revolving around deeply held beliefs. The series was absolutely ''dripping'' with GrayAndGreyMorality, and quite a few people were offended by the very concept that a particular side might be considered morally acceptable. There were all sorts of comparisons to the Nazis ([[PuttingOnTheReich justified in one case]], though there were still people who supported that faction, because they thought the rest were even worse!)
  453. * Nintendo's announcement that they had no plans to localize ''XenobladeChronicles'', ''VideoGame/TheLastStory'' OR ''Pandora's Tower'' to America did not sit well with the gaming community in the slightest. It doesn't help when they actually say "Thanks so much for your passion, and for being such great fans!", which [[BerserkButton struck one hell of a nerve with Nintendo fans]] and only made them ''angrier.''
  454. ** To the point where an existing movement, [[http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Operation_Rainfall Operation Rainfall]], wants to actually ''flood'' [=NoA=]'s mailbox with letters convincing them to localize these games. So, it's actually evolved into [[UpToEleven Real-life Backdraft]] too.
  455. ** Their efforts are seemingly working, as the game is set for a limited April release in the United States.
  456. *** This didn't stop fans for chastising Nintendo about playing it safe with a limited release, as the European version had no problem selling in a wide release(albeit a part of Operation Rainfall's campaign). Europe being a much bigger continent didn't help.
  457. ** ''TheLastStory'' has been announced for a wide U.S. release. With Op. Rainfall's efforts succeeding, the backdraft is starting to subside...
  458. * "Is NiGHTS a boy or a girl?" Type that question into a NiGHTS forum and watch the amusement. It doesn't help that NiGHTS is [[WordOfGod officially]] genderless, yet has a female voice actor who doesn't even try to act androgynous.
  459. * Go pretty much anywhere online. Find a VideoGame/{{Portal}} related thread. Now, mention you dislike/hate Wheatley. Smell that? Those are the flames starting.
  460. ** Likewise, it's a bad idea to mention you don't like GLaDOS.
  461. ** Is Chell [[spoiler:going to be ok after she escaped the lab or has the [[VideoGame/{{Half-Life2}} Combine]] destroyed everything and she's pretty much screwed]]? No two people will fully agree on the answer.
  462. ** Try saying that you did not think TheCakeIsALie was funny at all. Just try it.
  463. * If the topic of MetalGearSolid2 arises, don't mention that you liked [[TheScrappy Raiden]]. It generally ends pretty badly.
  464. ** Similarly, The Boss in ''MetalGearSolid3''. Admirable example of devotion and selflessness who gives the series a more thoughtful meaning, or unnecessary character who's too obsessed with patriotism to like? Additionally, fans of The Boss don't tend to get on with Raiden fans.
  465. * FIFA vs Pro Evolution Soccer. Just put that as a topic title, and enjoy the nuclear fallout.
  466. * Go on the forums of either LeagueOfLegends or HeroesOfNewerth and express your opinion about the other being superior, or even them both being quality games. Either way the flames will start. Especially effective if things like graphics, originality and skill cap are mentioned.
  467. * On GaiaOnline, smoking related items in the gold shops were removed with no warning, the explanation being that Gaia didn't want to set a bad example. To says users were pissed would be the Understatement of the century. Nearly every thread in Site Feedback and Community Discussion was complaining about the smoking ban. Many users were boycotting Gaia Cash until the items came back. Many more users created overly sexual or violent avatars (and a few drunken ones to boot) to express their hate for the ban. Needless to say, the ban was lifted in two days. The users of Gaia do NOT like to have items taken away because they "represent immoral activities". Just go into the SF and suggest that Gaia tone down the raunchiness of items, or take away certain items all together. Your thread WILL be flooded with opposition.
  468. ** That was the work of one person, not to the developers of Gaia as a whole. He started the ban without the approval of his boss, or any in put from the rest of the developers. He quit for obvious reasons.
  469. * If you ever mention that you like Saber/Shirou on a VisualNovel/FateStayNight topic, be prepared for Rin/Shirou fans to rip into you for 'daring' to prefer the 'whimpy, childish route'. Also, if you say you prefer Rin, Saber fans will point to the UpdatedRerelease and RevisedEnding and yell that Saber/Shirou is the most 'canonical' ending. However, both Saber and Rin fans tend to ally against Sakura fans, who, while being the smallest group, can certainly be extremely...shall we say dedicated? All in all, just keep your preferences to yourself and replay which ever route you prefer. Better for everyone that way, really.
  470. * The [[VideoGame/{{Minecraft}} Minecon]] Yogscast fiasco.
  471. ** Speaking of Minecraft, go on and say the new changes to the game are a welcome addition (enderdragons, hunger/EXP system, etc.) and see how many people you can get to say how Minecraft was tons better without all the added trinkets and changes.
  472. ** With Notch stepping down as head developer of Minecraft and handing the controls over to Jeb, try to say Jeb will do a good job like Notch or surpass Notch. The flames will be enough to smelt all your iron ores without the need for coal!
  473. * Mentioning that you like ''VideoGame/HarvestMoon: Back to Nature'' over ''VideoGame/HarvestMoon64'' isn't a good idea, as is mentioning you prefer the newer titles over the older ones.
  474. * Krystalak and Obsidious in the game ''{{Godzilla}}: Unleashed'' are a surefire way to start a flame war just by the mere '''mentioning''' of their names. Are they two unique and original monsters added to the game? Or, would Atari have been better off using more monsters from the films? No two fans can ever agree.
  475. ** Obsidious also gets the dubious "honor" of being voted by the fandom to be featured in the game. Was he worthy of being featured in the games? Or, were the other potential new monsters (IE: Fire Lion, The Visitor, and Lightning Bug) better choices in the long run?
  476. ** Mention you think the PS2 version of the game is superior to the Wii version or vice versa. Enjoy the flames.
  477. ** Try asking "Why isn't (insert monster here) in the games?". You'll most likely get a ton of flaming messages in response stating "Because (insert monster here) SUCKS!".
  478. *** More specifically, try asking if KingKong should've been in the game. You'll get a ton of flames in response. [[hottip:note: The reason why King Kong wasn't used in the game was because Universal/RKO wanted $1,000,000 in liscencing fees to use him in the game. Which is way more than the $25,000 Toho required for each of their monsters.]]
  479. * A efficient way to start a FlameWar is to compare ''SkywardSword'' with ''{{Skyrim}},'' and side with either game, but not both. Cue Zelda and Elder Scrolls fans crawling out of the woodwork and throwing profane insults at each other. Curiously enough, [[TakeAThirdOption liking both]] won't get you flamed.
  480. ** ''Skyward Sword,'' ''Skyrim'', and ''VideoGame/FinalFantasyXIII-2'': All three games received perfect scores in ''Weekly Famitsu.'' [[PassThePopcorn Did they deserve it?]]
  481. * [[ShipToShipCombat Which is the best path/who is the best girl]] in VisualNovel/KatawaShoujo?
  482. ** Or alternatively: Was it worth the wait? Is it even worth playing? Is it a respecful portrayal of disabled people, or badly-disguised "cripple porn"?
  483. ** On a cold night simply just mention the name "Shizune", watch as the militant Shizu-haters declare her to be Worse than Hilter while the equally militant Shizubros declare anyone who didn't like her route to be dull witted simpletons who are too stupid to understand it, and enjoy the s'mores.
  484. ** "So I had a theory on/problem with Hanako's path--[[KillItWithFire OH DEAR LORD]]!"
  485. *** Bonus flame points if you dare to broach the subject of whether or not [[spoiler:her only H-scene can be considered rape. [[WordOfGod Even when, in-story, Hanako herself explains that it wasn't]].]]
  486. ** cpl_crud posted a short story on a possible DistantFinale for Hanako's path, called "[[http://cplcrud.wordpress.com/4ls-era-fanworks-and-scraps/a-runners-afternoon/ A Runner's Afternoon]]", in which the end of the first part implies that Hanako is cheating on her husband. (The truth is that [[spoiler:Hanako was recently divorced from a therapist who had treated her when she was ''committed to an asylum'' [[TearJerker after suffering a nervous breakdown when Hisao had a second heart attack]].]]). There were more flames than Hanako's house fire when her fans accused cpl_crud of derailing her into an adulterer.
  487. ** Come on, call Lilly a MarySue. [[SchmuckBait I dare you, I double dare you.]]
  488. * Go onto any forum and say that ''AsurasWrath'''s amount of QTE's are a good part of the game. Hell say that Asura's Wrath was an actual game unlike what people were saying it was no more than an interactive movie, or vice versa. The flames of wrath possibly start to outrival the title character himself.
  489. * Go to the MAG forums. You don't even have to do anything. It's an eternal flame.
  490. * If you want to spare your life, never, ever, tell a hardcore retro {{Rayman}} fan that you enjoyed ''RaymanOrigins''. Regardless of whether you've played the older games or not, they'll say something along the lines of "ORIGINS [[RougeAnglesOfSatin SUX! U ONLY LIEK IT CUZ U NVR PLAIED TH OLD GAEMS]]!!!!111"
  491. * For many ''{{ICO}}'' and ''ShadowOfTheColossus'' fans, stating whether "ee-ko" or "ai-ko" is the correct pronunciation (despite the fact that it is spelt "IKO" in katakana and Fumito Ueda specifically pronounced it as "ee-ko") or whether Agro is a stallion or a mare tends to get certain forums up in flames remarkably fast.
  492. * Should an eventual ''[[BaldurSGate Baldur's Gate III]]'' be a continuation of ''[[GrandFinale Throne of Bhaal]]'' or a complete different story with a new protagonist? Don't answer! Or you’ll end up in the [[PlaneOfWhatever elemental plane of fire!]]
  493. * Argue that you love ''[[StarControl Star Control III]]'' and you consider it canon. [[StarfishLanguage *Dancing*]] will ensue.
  494. * ''VideoGame/{{Bayonetta}} 2''[='=]s WiiU exclusivity. Dear Mother of God. People are making ''death threats'' to Creator/PlatinumGames for it. Granted, there are some who are reasonably upset at not wanting to buy a new console to play it, but most of them are just playing the age-old "NINTENDO'S FOR LITTLE KIDS" card.
  495. [[/folder]]
  496. [[folder:Other]]
  497. * Go ahead, bring up whether or not VideoGames are a viable form of artistic expression. See what happens, and be sure to mesure how far the crater goes. This works pretty much ''anywhere'', online and off.
  498. * CharacterTiers.
  499. ** [[MemeticMutation TIRES DON EXITS!!]]
  500. * Go to any gaming forum with a lot of WebAnimation/ZeroPunctuation fans and say anything good about {{Nintendo}}. [[FanHater Wrath]] like you've never known.
  501. ** For that matter, go to The Escapist Magazine (ZP's current home site), head over to their forums and say anything good about anything Yahtzee's ever bashed, be it a game or an entire genre. Expect a lot of quotes from his videos during the posts that start flaming you.
  502. * Go to any gaming forum and mention {{emulation}}, then break out the sticks and marshmallows as people scream about when -- if ever -- they should be used.
  503. ** Similarly, whether the original translation (if any), various fanlations, or updated retranslations of a given game are better.
  504. ** And in some places, "I don't emulate. I buy real copies" translates to "Hi, I'm an idiot for not pirating, please murder me as brutally as possible."
  505. *** In ''some'' places, saying you buy games ''at all'' translates to that. Especially PC games, which translates to "free game" for most [[strike:people]] [[strike:[[DigitalPiracyIsEvil assholes]]]] [[strike:netizens]] people.
  506. * Related to the above, if you want to see the true IQ level of people on a forum, talk about how good it is to have old games up for sale on current gen consoles (Example: Nintendo Wii's Virtual Console) or that remaking/porting over an old game is a good idea. Expect to see [[NostalgiaFilter nostalgic fans]] demand you to go buy the original game and console, while others tell you that you are stupid to pay for "overpriced" [=ROM=]s and if you were smart like them, you'd go and download free [=ROM=]s from the internet.
  507. ** And while we're on the subject of [=ROMs=], bring up the topic of whether or not pirating them is [[DigitalPiracyIsEvil against the law]] or totally justified.
  508. ** Some people also think you are stupid to pay for games in general when you can go download them for free from the internet.
  509. * One can easily start a flame war on virtually any gaming forum by voicing any opinion on whether or not graphics and eye candy are crucial to the enjoyment of a game.
  510. * Don't mention the words "Improved Anvil" within the Infinity Engine modding community, unless you've brought enough marshmallows for everyone to roast once the flame war gets going. Also, the words "Black Wyrm's Lair" are a very handy attractant for both the admin of that message board and his troll nemesis, who will also start a flame war.
  511. * Mention the "Lawn Gnome Incident" on Maidens of the Kaleidoscope. You have been warned.
  512. * CopyProtection, especially DRM vs. Piracy.
  513. * Go to a PC gaming website, and suggest that a given FirstPersonShooter is as good on consoles as its PC counterpart. Then run.
  514. * Want to annoy fans when it comes to video game difficulty? Either proudly state that all games should be [[NintendoHard very punishing and difficult]] for the sake of having a good challenge, or that all games should be easier to reel in more new players to the series.
  515. ** For added fun, go to [=SMWCentral=] and mention that you like ''KaizoMarioWorld'' anywhere but its designated Kaizo board. Or even better, make a Kaizo-esque hack of VideoGame/SuperMarioWorld and then complain on the boards when it doesn't get accepted. To cause aneurysms, mention the phrase "Stacked Munchers" and how you don't mind seeing them.
  516. * Go to a forum dedicated to competitive arcade gaming. Go to a thread for an arcade you don't go to, make a post for any reason whatsoever, and admit that you don't go to that arcade. Now, hope that you don't get verbally gangbanged.
  517. * Go make a message board thread complaining about a feature. Say the word "skill" in any part of your post. It's like [[PressXToDie pressing X to die]].
  518. * No one is arguing that MediaWatchdogs and MoralGuardians aren't absolutely right about PoopSocking being unhealthy. But whenever a law is proposed to require AntiPoopSocking measures in games or find ways to legally ban PoopSocking, watch the vigorous debates between people who think such laws are necessary to protect gamers and their possible dependents and people who think such measures are nanny-statist attempts to impinge on personal responsibility.
  519. * Make a forum post asking why they censored the game for the Germans (No holocaust, swastikas), but decided not to bother appeasing the Chinese.
  520. * Wanna get a bunch of people to go completely berserk on you? Make a forum post at Facepunch Studios saying that you pirated Garry's Mod, or imply it otherwise. ''Hoo boy.'' For example, try this: http://www.facepunch.com/showthread.php?t=769327
  521. ** Even better: go to any of the release threads where the author uploaded his/her stuff onto garrysmod.org and nowhere else. Make a post requesting the upload of the stuff elsewhere. There you go. The logic behind this is that a few months ago, garrysmod.org changed its login system so that during registration, the site requests Steam login information to check if you really bought the game. Not logging in means no downloading stuff; GenreSavvy authors tell everyone in advance not to ask for this.
  522. ** Some time before that, the site experimentally changed its downloading system to Bittorrent to reduce server load. After a week or so, the admins changed it back to FTP due to [[TheyChangedItNowItSucks the massive amount of negative feedback they got]]. Also, make a diminuitive post about SVN (version control software used by high-profile addons to ease updating), just try it.
  523. * When it comes to {{MMORPG}}s that are pay to play or have a cash shop, expect swift retribution to fall upon you if you so much as bring up lowering the prices. You'll get a few people backing you up and several hundred screaming at you about your selfishness.
  524. ** F2P, or Free To Play MMMORPG's have somewhat of a different reaction, sometime you'll get the above reaction, where other times... not as much.
  525. ** This is played straight and horribly averted when it comes to Nexon, particularly with MapleStory. Those who love Nexon and declare that they can do wrong will lash out at you, and possibly some who bought items at full price. The other portion, the arguable majority, will rally in support of you, declaring that Nexon is evil and will insist that they drop or lower prices of cash items. Expect several hundred debates to pop up. And heaven forbid you attempt to TakeAThirdOption.
  526. * [[EasternRPG JRPGs]] versus [[WesternRPG WRPGs]], especially when you add in the debate over what a real RPG is and whether a certain game or even an entire genre actually counts as a "real" RPG. Doesn't help when even some of the [[BioWare pros]] throw down some kindling.
  527. ** For added points, question the need for a separate "JRPG" category in the first place because "an RPG is an RPG, right?" You'll get the same [[SeriousBusiness violent response]] you get if you dare to refer to {{Anime}} as "just another form of cartoon".
  528. ** VideoGame/MassEffect2 is one of the greatest examples of this. Go to an appropriate forum and talk about it being either an WRPG or a [[ThirdPersonShooter TPS]], and prepare to see your thread's page count grow.
  529. * Violence in games: genuine fuel for real-world aggression or harmless victim of media targeting? Just don't.
  530. ** Gaming controversy works in a paper-scissors-stone cycle. Don't suggest that parents should actively police what their children play, as you'll be attacked by people who think that's an infringement of their freedom. Don't suggest that either, because you'll be attacked by people who think the companies should take responsibility to prevent certain players getting their hands on some games. Suggest ''that'' and you'll be attacked by people blaming lazy parents for not being responsible.
  531. * Discussions of devices like Game Shark and Action Replay can turn into this, they're either good ways to get more milage out of your game or they take out all the fun and will kill the game. (To be truthful, they can hurt the game, it depends on how careful the user is to avoid problem codes and how much moderation they exercise in using the devices.)
  532. * Continues in arcade games, particularly their arcade ports. If you think games need unlimited continues, you're a {{scrub}} who can't play the game right. If you're fine with limited continues, you're a StopHavingFunGuy. This issue carries over to professional reviewers, who are more or less unpleasable about this: give a game limited continues, and it's "this game is impossible, no game should have limited continues EVAR", go with unlimited continues and it's "this game is easy, you never die."
  533. * Among amateur game designers and the people who play their products, there's a debate over whether using a '[[{{Retraux}} retro]]' graphics style is an appealing and legitimate design choice which takes effort to master, an unattractive soft option for lazy or untalented people, or a pretentious attempt to look different.
  534. [[/folder]]
  535.  
  536. ----
  537.  
  538. [Webcomics]
  539.  
  540.  * CtrlAltDel, [[CrossesTheLineTwice on three separate occasions]], set the internet ablaze.
  541. ** The first was during the RoM-icide incident, when the series creator, Tim Buckley, deleted most of the forum posters after he was caught alledgedly [[{{Squick}} sending a picture of his penis to a 15 year old girl.]] [[hottip:*:which is a myth- but the deletions were definitely not]]
  542. ** The second was after the infamous [[http://www.cad-comic.com/cad/20080602 Loss strip.]] Sending the series into CerebusSyndrome at full force, made worse by Buckley's blog post in response to the strip.
  543. ** The third was the infamous Abby-gate incident, when it was discovered that Buckley [=GISed=] one of his characters, [[http://forums.g4tv.com/showthread.php?t=150312 shamelessly copying another persons artwork.]]
  544. * ''AModestDestiny'' by Squidi versus ''PennyArcade'''s forums due to copyright concerns -- more detail [[http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?t=49593 here]].
  545. * Want to start a fight on ''this'' wiki? Refer to ''"Webcomic/Webcomic/ElGoonishShive"'' and "NoBisexuals" in the same discussion. There will be aftershocks for months. On the page for [=EGS=], NoBisexuals is followed by a warning not to get started.
  546. ** Come to think of it, criticize EGS on this wiki and you can measure how long before [[EditWar it gets removed]] in the minutes.
  547. * David Morgan-Mar wanted to use the correct terminology: is the Lego implement in [[http://www.irregularwebcomic.net/1902.html this]] ''IrregularWebcomic'' strip a spade or a shovel? So he looked it up online and found that no one can agree on the difference between spades and shovels, if there even is one. His below-the-comic commentary on the confusion simply inspired more people to weigh in and further confuse the issue.
  548. ** Curiously, a lot of the confusion (especially the author's initial confusion) seems to come down to excessive literalism and people taking the same words to mean different things. At least in the UK, the definitions are as follows: ''(missing)''
  549. * One real sad one is 20% of the internet vs. the other 80%. What makes them fight so? The quality of ''CtrlAltDel''. 20% says it's okay, 80% says... [[FanHater something]] [[{{Hatedom}} else]].
  550. ** Though this is obviously only about people that know/care about it.
  551. * ''BadlyDrawnKitties'' and ''BetterDays'' began as a joint effort to write the same characters at different points in their lives, until a notorious schism between the authors, leading to {{Take That}}s such as ''Badly Drawn Kitties'' [[DroppedABridgeOnHim dropping a bridge on]] the lead of ''Better Days'' and the creator of ''Better Days'' turning a major character's [[AnythingThatMoves somewhat prominent]] bisexuality into an AbortedArc. Bring up either, anywhere, and you're likely to start a fight over who wronged whom; bring one up on the other's forum, and may God have mercy on your soul.
  552. ** Better shortcut than that: mention the reason that the two comics split, IE, the two creators ended their relationship. No, seriously, that's not a dig.
  553. * In the official ''[[Webcomic/TheOrderOfTheStick Order of the Stick]]'' [[http://www.giantitp.com/forums/forumdisplay.php?f=22 forum]], you can raise a flame with several issues: Vaarsuvius' gender, the nature of the Monster in the Darkness, if Miko was meant to be Roy's love interest (or anything about Miko at all, really), Haley's mother nature, and if the webcomic is going to be upgraded to ''D&D'' 4e. Ironically, almost all points received the WordOfGod about them, and most of the time the flame will be started by people claiming to be sick reading that issue AGAIN. Newbies are going to have hard times.
  554. ** And yet people will let any EpilepticTrees theory, no matter how ridiculous, fly. Personal favorites include: "Thog is a member of the orc tribe that captured Elan/Durkon/V", "Therkla is Haley in disguise" ('''''WHAT!?'''''), etc.
  555. ** Oh, and just do not mention what happened between Belkar and the Oracle. The mechanics of that incident are vague enough for people to interpret it in any one of several ways, and they're all convinced their view is the right one. Were the Oracle's attempts to placate Belkar genuine, i.e., did he think that Belkar ultimately ''did'' cause Roy's death? Was the Oracle pissing off Belkar ''so'' he would kill him? For some reason, the latter theory has somehow caused the Oracle to be labeled a MagnificentBastard and ThePlan, even though "rile a maniac into murdering you" sounds like just about the worst plan in history.
  556. ** [[AntiHero Vaarsuvius]]'s alignment, and anything related, especially [[spoiler: Familicide]].
  557. * ''{{Erfworld}}'': Ansom's ability to beat Parson's schemes, and whether [[spoiler:uncroaking the volcano]] was a DeusExMachina.
  558. * Try to say something positive about ''DominicDeegan'' on this wiki and watch [[{{Natter}} the flood roll in]].
  559. * [[RuleOfThree Or]] CtrlAltDel.
  560. * Or ''TheWotch''.
  561. * On the ''{{Misfile}}'' forums, just ask "The Infamous Pedal Question" or raise the issue of gender pronouns. Or call Hazelton's answer to the question an {{Asspull}} and see how many seconds until it's reverted.
  562. * Over on the forums for the furry webcomic ''LasLindas'', a huge forum war erupted after [[http://laslindas.katbox.net/?p=321 this strip]] (as well as the strips that came [[http://laslindas.katbox.net/?p=319 before]] and [[http://laslindas.katbox.net/?p=323 after]] that one) were posted; fans were split over whether or not Miles deserved to get dumped because of what he did to Taffy (he'd been in a relationship with her for quite some time without any intimacy between them). Though it's been over a year since the "war" there, every so often, a new fan will join the forums and attempt to reignite it (longtime forum regulars are usually quick to defuse the situation, especially those who were at the center of the original "war"), and several forum members still hold small grudges against those who opposed their viewpoint on the situation.
  563. ** We'll just reserve this space for the fallout of Rachael and Mora's fight.
  564. ** Hell, the overall quality of the comic itself tends to spark rather heated debates, to the point where some of it has spilled onto this very wiki.
  565. * Any discussion of the LesYay in ''Webcomic/GunnerkriggCourt''. ("You're a homophobe!" "You're a {{Lolicon}} YuriFanboy!")
  566. ** For extra fun: "Did Reynardine really attempt to [[spoiler:possess Annie]]? (If not, was it part of a {{plan}}?" The forum has gone on for pages about it, and there's still no consensus, and probably will not be until it is resloved in-comic.
  567. * Mention how much you love {{Megatokyo}} anywhere else than its official forum. Sit back and watch the wank. For a bonus, say that you think it got better since Rodney left.
  568. ** One needn't go outside the MegaTokyo forums to get into a flamewar about MT. It's apparently popular, for those outside the "Story Discussions" and "SD Fanworks" subforums, to take a dump on the comic, even if without the comic the other forums ''wouldn't exist'' (it's not internet fairies paying the forum bandwidth, after all).
  569. * ''FanFic/GrimTalesFromDownBelow''. Three words: [[spoiler:MANDY DID WTC.]] This one comic has managed to cause many a flame war.
  570. * [[Webcomic/EightBitTheater Brian Clevinger:]] An ''avante guarde'' artist whose false endings and anticlimax moments are a brilliant deconstruction of epic storytelling? Or a creative sadist who's realized that he can tease and torture his fanbase any way he likes and they'll still keep coming back for more? His own words, that "the best jokes are the ones played on the audience", certainly don't help matters.
  571. ** Everytime this happens, the fans come out in their thousands, most begging and pleading for things not to really end like this, others handing out well-meaning compliments and thanks for a well-written comic, and a strong minority who fall over themselves trying to be the first SmartMark to spot the gag and make fun of others who believe the setup is for real.
  572. * ''PennyAndAggie''
  573. ** Helen: misunderstood [[TheWoobie woobie]] underdog, or spiteful, self-pitying traitor? If you like forum discussions well exceeding twenty pages ''per thread'', you'll love this.
  574. ** [[PortmanteauCoupleName Agenny]]: The strip's inevitable outcome, shameless OOC (albeit well-foreshadowed) {{Fanservice}}, or a fanfiction-level AssPull? Should they stay together or not? In-character, was it a good idea in the first place, or not?
  575. ** Waltrip vs. Lagace vs. Milholland. Milholland vowed never to do another guest arc again after the first two... and then he did a {{Crossover}}.
  576. ** PennyAndAggie ''anything''. That fandom can pick ''anything'' to the bones, suck out the marrow, and write a treatise on the meaning of each joint.
  577. * ''[[MenageA3 Ménage à 3]]'': Zii: LoveableSexManiac, or ManipulativeBastard KarmaHoudini?
  578. * [[OverlyLongGag Have we mentioned CtrlAltDel yet?]]
  579. * For as widely respected as PennyArcade is, its subject matter choices and...let's say "irreverent" approach have produced a few.
  580. ** Most recent was the controversy over the infamous "dickwolves" comic, which turned into a six-month internet war that resulted in boycots of PAX and death threats directed at the main players on both sides.
  581. ** A more insular version came back in 2006, when the guys mocked a webcomic documentary they found silly and pretentious, especially the performance of webcomic artist Cat Garza.
  582. * The ''Webcomic/{{Homestuck}}'' fandom has its own special word for this: [[BaseBreaker Vriska]]chat.
  583. ** Please DontAsk about the replaced music in a few animations. It [[TheyChangedItNowItSucks brings up]] [[BrokenBase unpleasant memories]]. [[hottip:* :The explanation can be found in the [[Headscratchers/{{Homestuck}} JBM Homestuck page]].]]
  584. ** One sorta-started after Hussie made a tumblr post saying that all the characters lack any race, and then [[OrwellianRetcon edited a line of text to make reflect that.]]
  585. * Discuss Literature/SailorNothing. Is it a brilliant deconstruction that totally predates more subversive stuff released recently, like MadokaMagica or PrettyCure? Or a BloodierAndGorier piece of i-net crap with a creepy obsession with RapeAsDrama and has massive research failure in regards to Japanese culture? Is it true that more than one local TVT edit about it was actually made by the author himself or people in his inner circle, or are these just coincidences? Either way, think twice before asking.
  586. ----
  587.  
  588. [Western Animation]
  589.  
  590.  * Head over to Blog/CartoonBrew and try to post a nice, mature, rational argument that motion capture technology is a valid form of animation when used well. We'll be behind you with the marshmallows...
  591. ** Actually, just post anything (in a polite or not combative tone) about the industry that Amid personally disagrees with. Before you even get flamed, you'll more than likely just be deleted, IP banned and deactivated from the blog, and then mysteriously gain your posting privileges back 2 weeks later.
  592. ** Heck, motion capture is a picnic compared to what happens if you even casually mention anything remotely connected to the question of whether cartoons should have scripts or storyboards, and whether non-artists should write for animation. From there it quickly devolves into a battle over [[RenAndStimpy John Kricfalusi]], who's a very vocal advocate of storyboards, and who attracts very rabid [[FanBoy fanboys]] and an avid {{Hatedom}}, the latter resulting from some of his SmallNameBigEgo qualities.
  593. * Add ''WesternAnimation/FamilyGuy'' to this. ''Family Guy'' has become a good source of heated debate there for a while, only to come to a head in this [[http://www.cartoonbrew.com/disney/family-guy-goes-disney.html# comments recent blog post]], with 105 replies and counting. Jerry Beck himself is a self-admitted hater of the show. [[http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YNrISzUMLRA This person]] believes that ''WesternAnimation/FamilyGuy'' should be canceled off the air for [[DeadBabyComedy repeating pop-culture reference gags]], and he even bashes Seth for [[OnlyInItForTheMoney making cartoons just for cash over entertainment]].
  594. ** Say you like "Not All Dogs Go To Heaven". They'll treat you the same way as Brian.
  595. * After watching ''Film/{{Avatar}}'', Jerry Beck has said the following: "It turns out I don't hate mo-cap after all. I just hate RobertZemeckis and all his lousy animated films."
  596. * Whether or not the animated ''WesternAnimation/TeenTitans'' is part of the {{DCAU}}. Really. Also whether or not Robin in this series is Dick Grayson, Jason Todd, Tim Drake or "just Robin."
  597. ** It doesn't make a whole lot of sense to debate Robin's identity though -- [[WordOfGod it's confirmed]] he's Dick Grayson. Not that it stops them. This might be because the producer said he's not meant to be any one Robin, while one of the writers stated he was Dick Grayson.
  598. ** Speaking of ''Teen Titans'', mention the very last episode of the series, and watch as the {{Shipp|ing}}ers tear themselves into pieces.
  599. ** The fact that Nightwing already existed in the DCAU at the same time that Teen Titans was going on should be evidence that the two are separate Dick Graysons, but still, the flaming continues.
  600. * While some prefer to compromise between the two, "Is Azula a MagnificentBastard who deserved AFateWorseThanDeath, or is she TheWoobie who deserves a hug from her mommy?" will still start WorldWarIII at most ''WesternAnimation/AvatarTheLastAirbender'' forums.
  601. ** The reason this is such a problem is because, in some people's eyes, the show didn't actually explain why Azula is as nuts as she is. Zuko's backstory got tons of screen time, but Azula's didn't get nearly as much. Some fans argue that subtle buildup was there all along while others say her breakdown was still too sudden.
  602. ** Also: energybending.
  603. ** Hell, Katara's the one character who's almost always bound to cause some sort of backdraft, generally over who [[ShipToShipCombat she's shipped]] [[LauncherOfAThousandShips with]], whether or not she's a bitch [[KarmaHoudini who has a knack for not getting in trouble for her mistakes]], or if she's a [[MarySue bland canon-sue]] or a [[CharacterDevelopment balanced, well rounded character]].
  604. ** Who Zuko should be paired off with. To say it gets messy would be a huge understatement.
  605. ** New issue even though the show ended months ago: the [[RaceLift casting choices]] for the LiveActionAdaptation. Seriously, don't even try to mention or bring it up.
  606. ** Now that the movie has been released and was the [[TheSimpsons Worst. Movie. Ever]], mentioning this will get just a lot of told-you-sos and backpatting.
  607. *** As an added bonus, say that you liked the movie or that you though it wasn't as bad as people said it was. You'll have a nice warm inferno of flames in no time.
  608. * The finale of TheLegendOfKorra has brought [[BaseBreaker its own controversy]].
  609. ** [[BaseBreaker Mako]] has caused considerable amount of backdraft [[BrokenBase for a number of fans]]. He's either a guy with NoSocialSkills who sucks at making emotion-based decisions, or a total JerkAss who only thinks of himself and his own benefit.
  610. *** And Korra, too. Some people will pitch fits at the mere mention of her having flaws (like her [[AlwaysSomeoneBetter actually VERY justified insecurity]]) and accuse any dissenters of being misogynists, while others will unfairly accuse her of being a whiny FauxActionGirl and say that her fans are making her a PossessionSue. [[BaseBreaker Poor girl.]]
  611. * ''WesternAnimation/FamilyGuy'', ''TheSimpsons'', and ''WesternAnimation/SouthPark'', all have very devoted, and very separate fandoms. [[FandomRivalry Extolling the virtues of any of the other programs on a site dedicated to one of the particular shows is going to get you a quick ban, as will the mere suggestion that the other shows are anything more than a load of rubbish]]. Go on a forum for TV shows and put up something that is clearly in favor of one of these shows above all, you can set the world on fire.
  612. ** Not really. Both Simpsons fans and South Park fans will ally with each other immediately if WesternAnimation/FamilyGuy is ever mentioned in their presence. This crosses into real life: The Simpsons producers sent Matt Stone and Trey Parker flowers after South Park mocked the Family Guy writers in a two-part episode. However, if you ''dare'' like both TheSimpsons and WesternAnimation/FamilyGuy, or both WesternAnimation/FamilyGuy and WesternAnimation/SouthPark, you are ''doomed''.
  613. ** If you go to a Simpsons board: NEVER EVER EVER EVER EVER EVER EVER EVER EVER '''[[OverlyLongGag EVER]]''' talk about the joke in WesternAnimation/FamilyGuy where Quagmire rapes Marge and then kills all of the Simpsons members. ''NEVER''.
  614. *** This one's a sore spot for more than just the fans. Simpsons creator Matt Groening was so disgusted by the skit it almost irrepairibly ruined his friendship with Seth Mcfarlane.
  615. ** ''God help you'' if you like all three shows.
  616. * ''{{Daria}}'' fans still aren't finished arguing whether Trent and Daria should have made a go of it or about Daria kissing Tom and eventually replacing her best friend Jane as his girlfriend.
  617. ** Say you like the BizarroEpisode "Depth Takes A Holiday".
  618. * Even casually mentioning the {{Shipping}} Wars that occured within the ''WesternAnimation/DannyPhantom'' fandom are bound to open up some old wounds. See the "True Fan VS Anti-Fan" (AKA "[[SlashFic Slash]] VS Non-Slash" AKA "Danny/Sam VS Danny/Vlad VS Danny/[[LauncherOfAThousandShips is-there-anyone-this-kid-ISN'T-paired-up-with]]?" AKA "Canon vs Fanon" AKA... you get the idea) debacle.
  619. ** Likewise, NEVER mention that you are indifferent to the fact that the series has been cancelled.
  620. ** Wanna start a ''real'' war? Ask why the show was canceled. The only thing the fandom can agree on there is that it was a stupid move.
  621. ** Do '''NOT'', under any circumstances, mention that you dislike/hate [[AxeCrazy Dark Danny]] or ''[[WhamEpisode The Ultimate Enemy]]'' in general. The fandom will be all over you like flies on a rotting carcass.
  622. ** Was Season 3 an underappreciated season with interesting battles against powerful villains and the return of fan favorites? Or, was it a blatant examample of SeasonalRot and that it added nothing but pointless one-note characters and poorly thought-out villains? Fans will never fully agree on either.
  623. ** Dani. Fans either think she's [[EnsembleDarkhorse one of the best characters in the series]] or [[TheScrappy an annoying]] [[CanonSue "female wannabe" with the personality of a shoelace.]] Either way, she's bound to start a flame war.
  624. ** Was ''Phantom Planet'' (The series' finale) a well-made ending to the show and provided great closure for various storylines in the series? Or, was it a rushed mess of overhype that was desperate to tie up loose ends as quickly as possible? No two fans will agree.
  625. *** One aspect of the special in particular is whether or not making Tucker the new mayor of Amity Park was a good idea or if it was just a contrived way to give nearly all the main heroes a happy ending. It's sure-fire to start a flame war.
  626. ** Do '''not''' mention Vlad's VillainDecay in the fandom. Just...don't.
  627. ** Valerie Gray is bound to open up some old wounds. Especially if you ask if her character arc got any closure or not.
  628. * The 72 original ''WesternAnimation/{{Futurama}}'' episodes versus the four feature-length direct-to-DVD [[TheMovie movies]], which have become a sixteen-episode fifth season. Some are complaining the show has become [[DeadBabyComedy cruder]], [[DarkerAndEdgier darker]] and [[{{Dramedy}} more serious]] and is proceeding in a ''WesternAnimation/FamilyGuy'' direction - both in the respects that it was better pre-cancellation and that it uses more toilet humour/less witty scripting than before.
  629. ** Also, [[BrokenBase Bender's Game]]
  630. ** Season 6 is getting the same reactions. Even with the one of the episodes having a heartwarming ending, it STILL doesn't stop them.
  631. ** And whatever you do, don't even ''think'' about touching the [[OfficialCouple Leela/Fry Ship]]. ''Especially'' [[BrokenBase around either]] the FanFiction writers [[{{Fanon}} who want to see an entire show]] [[TheyDo based on them being a married couple]] with [[HumanMomNonHumanDad sight gag]] [[BabiesEverAfter offspring]] or the [[FanDumb "long-time"]] [[NoTrueScotsman "real" fans]] who insist the show ''[[TheyChangedItNowItSucks must be like]]'' TheSimpsons ''[[TheyChangedItNowItSucks and remain a static cartoon with no alterations in character setups]]'' '''''whatsoever'''''.
  632. * ''WesternAnimation/KimPossible'': Is the title character a strong female heroine with who shows [[CharacterDevelopment realistic character flaws over the course of the series]]? Or the victim of {{Chickification}} in favor of her ThisLoserIsYou sidekick [[TookALevelInBadass taking a level in badass]]? There are enough people who feel strongly about this that flame wars spring up around the topic quite often. And let's not even start with [[ShipToShipCombat Kim/Ron versus Kigo versus any other possible KP ship]].
  633. ** Another option is start a war between Fight For Five and Fight Against Five (people who want/don't want a 5th season for the show).
  634. ** Kim's rival [[AlphaBitch Bonnie]]: Does her [[FreudianExcuse crappy home life]] give her a good reason to belittle Kim and Ron at school? Some say yes and view Bonnie as a sympathetic character (and even an AntiHero), others say no, claiming that a FreudianExcuse for the AlphaBitch is the most WarpedAesop in children's programming. Arguments between these groups are almost as fierce as the ship wars. Oh, and speaking of ship wars, Kim/Bonnie and Ron/Bonnie tend to be fairly popular couples amongst the fanbase, so rivalries with Kim/Ron and Kigo come into play quite often. Kim/Bonnie and [=RonBon=] are so popular in fact that fanfiction of canon pairing [[PairTheSpares Junior/Bonnie]] is practically nonexistent.
  635. * Simply say that ''WesternAnimation/AvatarTheLastAirbender'', ''TheBoondocks'', ''WesternAnimation/TeenTitans'', or ''CodeLyoko'' are anime. If you want to commit suicide in a ''really'' painful way, say ''WinxClub'' is an anime, or even compare it to ''Manga/SailorMoon''.
  636. ** Which is always hilarious when one takes into account that Japanese refer to all hand-drawn or computer animation as "anime" (here's a hint, [[CaptainObvious the term is a shortened form of the term animation]]), so if shown there all those shows (and every other western animation) will be called anime anyway by a Japanese viewer.
  637. *** Calling them [[CriticalResearchFailure "an anime from Japan"]] is more likely to get you laughed off the forum, however. Unless you are an actor cast in a live-action adaptation, that is, in which case the laughter will be mixed with cries for you to either learn more or be fired.
  638. * What happened in the ''WesternAnimation/ChipNDaleRescueRangers'' fandom on St. Valentine's Day 1998 fits the description on top of this page perfectly. A new member stepped into [[http://www.theacorncafe.org/ the Acorn Cafe]] which was only six days old back then, posted special Valentine's Day greetings for Chip and Gadget, and launched [[ShipToShipCombat the biggest flamewar in the fandom's history]] between the "pro" and "anti" Chip/Gadget factions, also known as Ranger War II or St. Valentine's Day Massacre.
  639. * Go to an ''EdEddNEddy'' forum, and say you hate one of the three titular Eds. Oh boy...
  640. ** "What's under Edd's ha..... aagh, the flames! THEY BUUUURRRRNNNN!"
  641. ** Is Plank real or not? [[spoiler:[[WordOfGod Danny Antonucci confirmed that he's just a plank.]] If that's the case, how did he drive that bus and tell Johnny about the kitchen or to special order that lobster?]]]
  642. ** Justifying Kevin's actions has became somewhat touchy. If you claim that Kevin's either the kid who keeps the Eds in line for a good cause or the scourge of the earth, except some flames from both sides on the subject.
  643. * Say you like ''OutOfJimmysHead'', ''MyGymPartnersAMonkey'', or ''SquirrelBoy''.
  644. * Another flamestarter: [[{{Sixteen}} Fresh]] [[WesternAnimation/TotalDramaIsland Tv]] [[{{Stoked}} Cartoons]]. Good, because their more mature humor means that CN is finally starting to realize its PeripheryDemographic, or Bad because the realization of said demographic may or may not have inspired CN Real.
  645. ** Bringing up CN in general will start up heated wars over which era of CN was best (typically between 90s era vs. 2000s vs TheNewTens) [[BrokenBase And it]] [[UnpleasableFanbase may never get resolved.]]
  646. * Go to...well, pretty much nearly ANYWHERE on the Internet and say something that's even just slightly negative about {{Pixar}}. Even if you make just the ''tiniest'' criticism of one of their films, the [[FanNickname Pixtards]] will be all over you.
  647. ** On that note, go to ANYWHERE on the Internet mentioning ''{{Cars}} 2'' and there will be at least one person whining about ''TheIncredibles'' not getting a sequel.
  648. ** The furor surrounding ''{{Cars}} 2'' has likewise kicked up a lot of argument. For every person complaining that Pixar squandered their reputation for an easy buck, there's another defending the film, saying that Pixar is being held to unfairly high standards and not every film has to have the [[TearJerker big emotional moments]] (a hallmark of Pixar movies) in order to be good. Fanning the flames further was the rumor of a ''WesternAnimation/ToyStory 4''.
  649. ** Did you ever hear the story of the ''WesternAnimation/{{WALL-E}}'' fan who [[BanOnPolitics rather naively tried to start a mature and sensible debate on the enviromental and anti-consumerism messages]]? [[ForegoneConclusion The poor soul was doomed from the start]].
  650. ** All of the above pale in comparison to the flames generated by one question: [[UnfortunateImplications Is Pixar sexist?]] This has grown even worse with the announcement (now retracted) that Disney Animation Studios (headed by [[PixarRegulars John Lassetar]]) would no longer be making fairy tale movies to focus more on [[MostWritersAreMale appealing to boys]] and the firing of Brenda Chapman from ''WesternAnimation/{{Brave}}''.
  651. *** And now that the trailer for Brave is out, there's been a lot of complaining that the movie just looks like a mashup of ''Disney/{{Mulan}}'', ''WesternAnimation/HowToTrainYourDragon'', and ''Disney/{{Tangled}}''.
  652. ** Try to simply mention you're not that big of a fan of Pixar or that you don't much care for their films in general. You ''will'' be flamed.
  653. *** More specifically, say you didn't much care for WesternAnimation/{{WALL-E}}, WesternAnimation/ToyStory (either one of the films), or any other of the more critically acclaimed films. Or, mention you find {{Cars}} (and maybe Cars 2) to be horribly underrated.
  654. ** In general, it's a ''bad'' idea to even remotely suggest that Pixar films take the attention away from other animation companies. You will be flamed no matter what.
  655. * Mention you like Creator/DreamWorksAnimation more than you like {{Pixar}}. Apparently, according to some fans, this is a form of blasphemy and the only treatment is a massive flame attack against the unfortunate Creator/DreamWorks fan.
  656. ** Now that Creator/DreamWorks has started releasing fairly critically successful films, this has died down to the point where some ''Creator/DreamWorks'' fans will bash {{Pixar}} for being overrated and drawing attention away from Creator/DreamWorks's movies (such as how the extremely well received WesternAnimation/HowToTrainYourDragon was soon overshadowed by the ToyStory3 juggernaut). Some have even gone as to claim that WesternAnimation/{{Megamind}} would have been better received had Pixar released it. Of course, there is the fact that 2011 had DA have two critically hailed hits while Pixar released their first "rotten" film (RT 39%) that also was passed over for an Oscar nomination while both DA's features got shortlisted.
  657. * Go to the HappyTreeFriends social network board and bring up shipping. The flames will be visible from space. Such choice pairings include Flippy x Flakey, Flippy x Giggles, Giggles x Cuddles and Shifty x Lifty {{Twincest}}... Also good (if not better) is claiming that Flakey is either a boy or a girl, and to a lesser extent whether it is spelled F-L-A-K-E-Y or F-L-A-K-Y, since Mondo Media changed their minds about that, too.
  658. ** Even better, say it's a ripoff of RetardedAnimalBabies and if that hasn't [[BerserkButton pushed enough]], say it's better, give a gratuitously huge laundry list of reasons why.
  659. * Go near a [[WesternAnimation/{{Ben 10}} Ben]]/Gwen fansite and casually talk about how KissingCousins could ever appear in the show outside of {{Subtext}}. Run as far and as fast as you can.
  660. ** Judging from the reactions people on this site have to it, go to a Ben10 fansite and say that you believe that [[WesternAnimation/Ben10AlienForce Alien Force]] is a good follow-up to the original show, and agree with all the retconned changes. In fact, just admitting that you like [[WesternAnimation/Ben10AlienForce Alien Force]] might start a flamewar between the original fans and [[WesternAnimation/Ben10AlienForce Alien Force]] fans.
  661. ** Kevin Levin. Is he better as a WoobieDestroyerOfWorlds or as an AntiHero? Was it a good idea to have him become a good guy in Alien Force? Was him going insane again in Ultimate Alien a good example of a FaceHeelTurn or was it just a forced way to please the fans of "Evil Kevin"? Oh, and let's not forget him being shipped with Gwen. The sheer number of topics that could start a flame war involving Kevin alone is enough to start its own page.
  662. ** If you want to self-immolate yourself, go ahead and say you like Kevin's redesigns from ''Ben10Omniverse''.
  663. * ''TheFairlyOddparents'': Who is Tommy and Tammy's mother? Don't ask. [[ShipToShipCombat Really]]. ''[[ShipToShipCombat Don't]]''.
  664. ** For that matter, bringing up any of Timmy's love interests will likely start fires. The show's fanbase is pretty unstable right now, [[ShipToShipCombat for]] [[ShipSinking various different]] [[BaseBreaker reasons]].
  665. ** In general, it's ''not'' a good idea to ask whether or not Wanda is a nag or if Cosmo is an unappreciative JerkAss. For the longest time, this was one of the biggest [[BaseBreaker fandom splitting topics]] in the series. Even today, it can open up old wounds.
  666. ** Ask if Poof was a [[BabiesMakeEverythingBetter good addition to the series]] or if he's just another [[CousinOliver annoying forced-in child character.]]
  667. *** Speaking of Poof, ask if [[MisterSeahorse Cosmo being the "mother" (so to speak)]] means that the writers support MPREG or not. You will be flamed on all sides.
  668. ** Is Foop a good foil for Poof or is he just a poor [[WesternAnimation/FamilyGuy Stewie Griffin]] clone?
  669. * Mentioning (fem)slash in the DisneyFairies fandom. Have fun wiping the spit and soot off yourself.
  670. * In the ''WesternAnimation/PhineasAndFerb'' fandom, don't even begin to discuss who Ferb should go with. Seriously. Don't.
  671. ** Made [[UpToEleven even worse]] with an episode revealing that [[GirlOfTheWeek Johnny]] is now [[MsFanservice Vanessa's]] [[OfficialCouple boyfriend]]. And now another upcoming episode has them [[spoiler: breaking up...]]
  672. ** While we're on the subject of ''WesternAnimation/PhineasAndFerb'', say that WesternAnimation/SpongebobSquarepants is better than it around the fans. [[ShmuckBait Go ahead, try it]].
  673. *** For that matter, [[FandomRivalry avoid putting those two shows in the same discussion]] ''period''.
  674. * If you were a ''TotalDrama'' fan during the special and the second season, you got flamed to oblivion if you were on Team Courtney ''or'' on Team Harold, depending where you go.
  675. ** This has since died down, and the arguments now are mainly over whether [[BaseBreaker Ezekiel]] is returning/deserves to return.
  676. *** And now after ''that's'' cooled down, the [[ShipToShipCombat Duncan/Gwen vs. Duncan/Courtney shippers]] have started it up ''again''.
  677. ** Say you like [[CreatorsPet Owen]] or [[TheScrappy Sierra]] and that the former doesn't really get too much screentime. Go ahead, do it.
  678. ** Alternatively, say that you don't like [[BreakoutCharacter Cody]] or that he didn't deserve to win ''World Tour''.
  679. * Even before it began, the ''WesternAnimation/YoungJustice'' cartoon was already undergoing this. It's not an adaptation of the [[Comicbook/YoungJustice comic of the same name]], but it has led to people either trying to defend how appropriate the title is despite it not being an adaptation or criticizing using the title because it isn't one. The presence of Dick Grayson and Wally West instead of Tim Drake and Bart Allen has also invoked this.
  680. ** Their version of SelfDemonstrating/TheJoker. Either you thought it was an interesting interpretation, or he was the worst thing ever. Be prepared for comparisons to the [[WesternAnimation/BatmanTheAnimatedSeries Mark Hamill]], [[BatmanUnderTheRedHood John Dimaggio]], and [[Film/TheDarkKnight Heath Ledger]] versions of the character..
  681. ** The second season has just begun, and fans are already arguing about the TimeSkip. You either think it's unnecessary and [[WhatHappenedToTheMouse ignores several established characters]] [[TheyWastedAPerfectlyGoodPlot and plotlines]], or that it paves the way for new characters to shine. And don't even get fans started on [[ShipToShipCombat the fact that Superboy and Miss Martian have broken up and the latter is now with Lagoon Boy]].
  682. * FostersHomeForImaginaryFriends: Regardless of which forum you go to, it is usually best not to bring up with the fans any of the following: liking Goofball, promoting Mac x Frankie, general dislike against Frankie, Mac, Wilt, or any fan favorite character, saying you like Cheese, and thinking the post season 3 episodes weren't as good as the earlier ones. You have been warned.
  683. ** If I may add, it's probably best not to bring up pairings such as Herriman x Frankie or Wilt x Frankie. The debates can get... heated to say the least.
  684. * The WesternAnimation/MyLittlePonyFriendshipIsMagic episodes penned by Dave Polsky, "Feeling Pinkie Keen" and "Over a Barrel", have sparked a more than a few arguments, detractors claiming that the former is a direct attack against skepticism, and that the latter is a trivialization (or, in the most extreme arguments, ''glorification'') of the oppression towards Native Americans in the early '90s.
  685. ** "The Mysterious Mare-Do-Well" received an incredibly negative reaction, to the point where fan blog Equestria Daily had to actually tell fans to be civil toward the creators of the show. This was largely due to the perception of the characters acting like jerks, especially in how the [[AnAesop aesop]] of the episode is handled, in addition to inexplicable changes to the setting like the addition of construction vehicles.
  686. ** Compare bronies to [[FurryFandom furries]], or straight up call them furries. Everything in a two-mile radius will catch on fire.
  687. *** It works even better in reverse. Just mention My Little Pony on a furry board and watch as everything burns.
  688. ** ''Cupcakes.'' Just don't bring it up.
  689. *** [[DarkFic SweetAppleMassacre]] is even worse. It's better off not mentioning it at all.
  690. ** Derpy-- funny or offensive? Appreciated fandom nod or mindless PanderingToTheBase?
  691. *** This reached its pinnacle with "The Last Roundup", where after her scene in the episode was edited, Yamino, one fan artist who had complained a lot about her beforehand received a lot of hateful comments and was blamed as being one of the people complaining to Hasbro about the scene, despite the fact that she actually had nothing to do with it, according to one of the producers.
  692. ** The Bronycon Documentary and the Brony Thank You fund, which is aimed at getting a commercial thanking the creators of the show to air on The Hub, are two more topics that [[{{Troll}} come in handy if you disapprove of civil conversation]].
  693. ** Say that you think that John Delancie is just pandering to the Brony fanbase and doesn't really care about the fans, or vice versa. You will be flamed.
  694. ** Go onto Youtube. Find a video of Discord. Make a [[Series/StarTrekTheNextGeneration reference to "Q".]] You will be flamed. Yes, even if the video ''itself'' is referencing Star Trek (IE: A gag-dub of MLP clips with Star Trek audio).
  695. ** Say that you dislike any royal princesses (Luna, Celestia, and/or Cadence) for any reason (e.g [[RonTheDeathEater Celestia being a tyrant]], [[TheyWastedAPerfectlyGoodPlot Luna being useless]], or Cadence being a MarySue). Be ready for the trip to the moon.
  696. *** Better yet, try saying that their [[MemeticMolester "erotic"]] side, {{troll}} counter-part, and/or their "evil" side have more personality and/or more enjoyable than the canon side of the princesses. It ain't going to be pretty.
  697. ** In some circles of the fandom, saying you like Pinkie Pie will result in ridicule.
  698. ** Complaining how the toys don't look like in the show is bound to irk fans of the toys.
  699. ** Also, claiming that Season 2 is superior or has GrownTheBeard to SliceOfLife fans in their forums. God help you if you do that.
  700. * Say you hate ''WesternAnimation/LooneyTunes'' or ''WesternAnimation/TinyToonAdventures''. RUN. RUN FAST. RUN FAR.
  701. ** Say you like ''WesternAnimation/LoonaticsUnleashed'' or ''BabyLooneyTunes''.
  702. ** ''Film/SpaceJam'' or ''LooneyTunesBackInAction''? Discussions on which film is better or worse, are rarely progressive.
  703. *** Or likewise claim in the slightest that ''WesternAnimation/{{Animaniacs}}'' put too much emphasis on talky dialogue banter and talking heads than on visual humor. And God help you if you even mention that you think ''RenAndStimpy'' was closer to the spirit of golden age animation than it.
  704. *** Say you prefer ''PinkyElmyraAndTheBrain'' over ''PinkyAndTheBrain''... or that you like ''PinkyElmyraAndTheBrain'' in general... or [[TheScrappy Elmyra]].
  705. * CGI vs. 2D Animation. Bonus points if you blame {{Pixar}} for killing the latter.
  706. * Go to any ''{{Transformers}}'' forum and try to comment that [[TransformersGeneration1 Season 1/2 was better than Season 3]] (or the other way around). Alternatively, try to say ''WesternAnimation/BeastWars'' was the best thing in the entire franchise (for extra fuel for the fire, lump Beast Machines in there too).
  707. ** While you're at it, claim that G1 was not the diamond-encrusted gold-plated cartoon that some (extreme) fans make it out to be. Lump a little bit of "I like [[TransformersAnimated TFA]] / [[TransformersPrime TFP]]/series of choice instead". Prepare for the intense rage of a thousand supernovas.
  708. ** On the subject of ''TransformersPrime''- mention [[TheScrappy Miko]] [[GenkiGirl Nakadai]]. Say you like her. Say you hate her. Mention her ambiguous accent. Roast a steak in the ensuing heat.
  709. * ''TheSimpsons'': Say you liked "[[FanonDiscontinuity The Boys of Bummer]]". ''You will NOT survive''.
  710. ** Or liking [[BlackComedyRape "Homer vs. Dignity"]], [[{{Retcon}} "That 90s Show"]], [[BizarroEpisode "Saddlesore Galactica", "The Computer Wore Menace Shoes"]], "Kill The Alligator And Run", or "The Principal and the Pauper".
  711. ** Agree with [[SoapboxSadie Lisa]].
  712. ** Mention that the "Old Series" is better than the "New Series" or vice versa. While it isn't as explosive as it was back in the day, it can (and still does) spark a pretty heated debate.
  713. ** Go onto Youtube. Find a Simpsons clip. Post "If this were (insert rival show here), the gag would last for five minutes!". Sit back, and enjoy the flames.
  714. * Say you think that [[AmericansHateTingle Canadian cartoons]] are better than American cartoons, and that Creator/CartoonNetwork should focus more on them. Enjoy the burning.
  715. * Want some s'mores? Forget building a fire, just put a {{Nickelodeon}} or Creator/CartoonNetwork related video on Website/YouTube and roast the marshmallows over the flames made by nearly every comment complaining that Nick and CN don't acknowledge the existance of their 90's toons and/or that they need to air them more, along with calling their newer shows crap. [[HateDumb Given that Nick came up with The90sAreAllThat, and CN often acknowledges their original cartoons, it's really ridiculous.]]
  716. ** Even worse, say that you like ''AlmostNakedAnimals'' or ''{{Sidekick}}''.
  717. ** The only thing worse than that would be pretty much saying '''anything''' about JohnnyTest. Go onto a forum and say anything positive about it...and YOU WILL '''DIE'''.[[note]] Unless you say something about Dukey (and maybe Mary and Susan if you're lucky), pretty much the only darned character anyone likes.[[/note]]
  718. *** Even more worse, ''say you like the animation style''.
  719. * Before being brutally beaten, saying (even politely) that you didn't see anything pointing to [[OneTruePairing Martin/Aviva]] would get you told to keep your mouth shut. These days, go to any WildKratts discussion and tell Anti-Maviva supporters they don't have the right to speak, especially since the shipping war has died down. I'll wait here for your ashes so I can give them to your family.
  720. * ''SpongeBobSquarePants''
  721. ** If you're suicidal, just say you like "One Coarse Meal", "A Pal For Gary" or "Pet Or Pests" for a quick and painless death.
  722. ** Say that Casey Alexander and Zeus Cervas write the best episodes. Bonus flames if you add Aaron Springer to it.
  723. *** Say you like the post-movie era. We're waiting for the fire so that we can burn some Stay-Pufts.
  724. * ''WesternAnimation/KingOfTheHill''
  725. ** Say you like [[TheScrappy Peggy or Lucky]].
  726. *** To further fuel the flames, say you ship Lucky/Luanne.
  727. ** Say you like "What Makes Bobby Run".
  728. * ''CodenameKidsNextDoor'':
  729. ** Say you ship Numbuh 1 and [[TheScrappy Lizzie]].
  730. *** Anything to do with Lizzie in general.
  731. ** Say that you ''don't'' ship Numbuhs 3 and 4.
  732. ** Say you think Numbuh 5 is a CanonSue.
  733. ** Mention Father being a CompleteMonster or WoobieDestroyerOfWorlds.
  734. * Find any discussion on ''RegularShow''. Now, try to ask whether or not Benson is a well-meaning but over-stressed and underappreciated boss or if he's a complete jerk who treats his employees poorly.
  735. ** Futhermore, ask whether or not Mordecai and Rigby are decent workers who are abused by Benson or if they're lazy bums.
  736. * There are some people who hate the ''[[http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ndA69KiffJE Thunder LOLcats]]'' sketch on ''WesternAnimation/{{Mad}}'' because they believe memes don't belong on TV.
  737. ** There's also people, namely adults of children, who hate the ''DoraTheExplorer: The Road to Recovery'' skit in which the titular explorer throws up in Backpack while riding in a bus.
  738. *** There is also the skit in which Lightning McQueen basically [[spoiler:dies in a car crusher.]]
  739. * ''WesternAnimation/UltimateSpiderMan''...oh boy, ''Ultimate Spider-Man''.
  740. ** Expressing approval of the show in general. Bring something cool to drink.
  741. ** Say you enjoy the humor, including Spider-Man breaking the fourth wall. Watch {{Deadpool}} fans all over the net claim he has a monopoly on breaking the fourth wall. Bring aloe.
  742. ** Express admiration for any of Spider-Man's super hero compatriots...especially [[TheScrappy Nova]]. Get a fire extinguisher.
  743. ** Finally, say, or imply, that Ultimate Spider-Man is just as good, or better, than TheSpectacularSpiderMan. Wear flame-resistant clothes, and keep the fire extinguisher handy.
  744. * Go ahead, and say you liked the 2012 [[Film/TheLorax Lorax]] movie better than the 1972 TV special of the same name, then prepare to be torn to pieces.
  745. ** Then, for extra flames, say you liked ''TheCatInTheHat'' film better than you like the book and the special of the same name.
  746. * Go on, we dare you to point out any flaws in WesternAnimation/{{Brave}}. Whether they're real or not. Many fans will immediately chalk up ANY kind of criticism to misogyny, no matter what well-thought or {{troll}}ish arguments you have.
  747. ** Double if you say that you don't like Merida. Or compare her to the {{Disney Princess}}es. And ''particularly'' if you say she's [[GirlsneedRoleModels "more feminist"]] than them, save {{Mulan}}.
  748. ** Also, while discussing the Merida and Elinor conflict, be careful with your opinion. Was Merida a plucky girl who truly thought she could do things by herself, while Elinor either mollycoddled her or tried to manipulate her into a more "acceptable" pawn in the peacekeeping? Or was Elinor a genuinely well-intentioned mother for both Merida ''and'' the kingdom, while Merida was just a SpoiledBrat throwing tantrums at the thought of acting like an adult? Are there shades of grey in this, with both of them having good and bad points? Either way, don't ask.
  749. * Speaking of the {{Disney Princess}}es... Ask which one is the best. Or worse, which one is the "more feminist" and the "better role model for little girls". Prepeare to suffer a FateWorseThanDeath as you're bombarded the almost-inevitably toxic discussions on ValuesDissonance, misogyny, SlutShaming (specially if we're talking of [[{{Aladdin}} Jasmine]]), gender roles, whether [[BeautyAndTheBeast Belle]] suffers StockholmSyndrome or not, WhatMeasureIsANonBadass, etc.
  750. * There's nothing that will start flames on a TexAvery forum more than ''TheWackyWorldOfTexAvery''.